Bug report time, gotta make sure it can survive those damn half-thawed Pigeon AAMs
The F404/RM12 differs from previous F404 versions in:
• new fan with 10% increased flow capacity and increased bird
resistance
• modified stator regulation in the high-pressure compressor
(HTK)
• increased pressure level
• higher turbine outlet temperature
• improved material in turbine and afterburner
(EBK)
• modified afterburner (EBK)
• digital control system
• single engine version
In 2003, a new EBK system was introduced in the RM 12 with cooled flame holders as the old flame holders had too short a lifespan. The new EBK system was developed entirely by VFA and also received international attention. To replace the old flame holders, the entire engine must be removed from the aircraft. With the new system, only the worn parts could be replaced while the engine remained in the aircraft.
Of the original F404J engine, only 50% remained and Volvo Aero now became the owner (OEM) of the RM 12.
In November 2010, Volvo Aero reported how the RM 12 could be developed into the “RM 12EF” and replace the General Electric F414G that was trial installed in the Gripen Demo (Gripen NG or JAS 39E/F). Volvo Aero estimated that the F414G would be 30-40% more expensive over the entire life cycle.
After the orders from Switzerland and Brazil were received, the GE F414G was chosen as the engine for the Gripen NG. Volvo Aero instead invested in upgrading the existing approx. 220 RM 12 engines in JAS 39C and D. The upgrade consisted of optimized engine control in FADEC, a newer already developed turbine and more efficient fan.
Seems like Gripen C/D got a nice engine upgrade
The JAS 39C/D did get an engine upgrade sometime recently, but this would be a /late variation if anything in my opinion and we know literally nothing about the upgrade as far as I’m aware.
These are airframes that have been flying with other upgrades like HMD, radar, Meteor missile, IRIS-T, etc.
My brother the SAAF one is 2005 it would have this
They received the order to upgrade the engine / radar / etc in 2022.
Yeah, I’ve seen the 2022 engine upgrade order - probably not relevant for war thunder since I haven’t seen completion of the upgrade? I could be wrong
Here’s an article citing SAAB at that conference in 2011
“When it comes to the thrust produced, the aim is an increase of 2% to 15%, depending on customer requirement.”
“We have stated previously that it is possible to significantly increase the thrust of the existing RM12 engine at a very competitive cost. We will then have a more powerful and economical engine. It also means that we can upgrade the 220 engines that the Air Force already has whilst maintaining engine competence within country,” says Henrik Runnemalm, Head of Research at Volvo Aero.”
Maybe these are connected?
I don’t see why y’all couldn’t get the enhanced JAS 39C ahead of the JAS 39E, whatever you guys think would be better for the tech tree since it seems both are going to be happening.
This is from 1988 though, does not take into account multiple other upgrades as stated in my previous post: SAAF JAS-39C Technical Data and Discussion - #1400 by CorporalApollo
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Yep, see.
RM12 has an increase of 190°F
-402 has an increase of 200°F
Should be very similar at high mach.
That is all find and dandy brother.
But there is no time limit when devs must act. “He is essentially saying let me nerf your jet and then I will submit a report after”.
They have made changes and taken month to revert or correct. Some never happening.
If his concerns are legitimate. I say make it clear IN the initial report that drag may be altered to give the Devs a heads up and make their jobs easier. That is a more than reasonable option.
Go ahead nerf away. But make it clear to the devs such suggestions will have foreseeable ramifications.
Dev is more than aware, you dont need to worry…
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Yes, but devs get tied down with the following business quarter and things get put on the backburner all the time. Just like in every industry ever.
I am sure you can relate
They hype of this jet will surely die eventually and more content will be at the forefront of controversy. None of you can guarantee that “unintentional alterations” can easily be reverted.
“Trust me bro, I will submit a report” is a new amusing one, I do have to say.
PD tracking on the gripen seems to be rather poor. The skyflashes, which arent even the dogfight variant are basically worthless, and are copy pastes of the AIM-7E with the very long delay to start manuvering.
Lock shifts to chaff easily even when the tagrget has a 600m/s approach velocity and the missile is very suceptible to countermeasures. Missiles don’t track correctly unless the target is basically static and can miss even when the target flies ina straight line.
Locked targets in look up will dissapear from lock regularly.
Maybe the Tornado F.3 with Supertemps has spoiled me but I was hoping to be able to make use of the missiles in clutch heads ons, but apparently not.
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ACM ranged is nerfed to 9km like that of US fighters like the F-16C and D too.
This is with locking on with TWS or PD HDN Mode.
I rarely used the ACM on the tornado except the vertical ACM to get high aspect launches when truning in.
The track is still “PD TRACK”
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Are you getting kills with the Skyflash further than 10km? That is actually impressive I only use them for dogfighting since they burn out very quickly and drastically lose energy.
I only use them for close range head ons. Very deadly.
Nah, all enagements are more than 2km, but less than 6km typically.
Problem is that any launch under 4km the missile doesnt start its guidance untill its too late and then the missile massively undershoots its target.
Any launch more than 4km the missle goes stupid even in optimal conditions.
So far I have only managed to get kills against planes that have stalled out.
With the supertemps I can launch up to 20km and still get kills semi reliably or even as low as 2km and they find their mark almost always.
No it does not, it cant reach speeds at sea level it was able to pre nerf, let alone new rip speed. Its pretty far from old max speed limit too. If it stayed same, nothing would change as you cant reach it in level flight.
hmmm sounds like its “valid” to compare these two engines… jesus christ… Gripen vs Mirage 2000 all over again.
Doing some testing of the SKyflash on the Phantom/Tornado and the skyflash on the Gripen…
The skyflash on the gripen seems to be copy pasted from the AIM-7E (Not even the AIM-7E2)
Edit:
It must be in my head.
In the test scenario the missiles perform the same… but in live battles they stuggle to hit anything lol.