Definitely.
I was considering that since it can carry all these different missiles and even IR guided missiles, it should receive the intended ability to mix and match its payload.
I assume in its spaded state:
Right side: 3 x HFK/KV (OR VT-1 if kv not added)
Left side: 2 x MIM-72 + 1 x Vulcan cannon
Making this a truly potent SPAA
The ability to have both radar and IR-guided missiles AND a gun would be insane. I hope this comes!
Wow, I thought that only Sweden ever made armed articulated haulers, glad to be proven wrong! Interesting that an air defence system with a Swedish radar ended up on a Swedish articulated hauler as part of a Swiss(?) project. I have to ask though, to what degree is this project actually German? The way I understand it, Contraves is a subsidiary of Oerlikon and Rheinmetall only purchases Oerlikon-Contraves in 1999, well after the SkyGuard-M was made (it evidently existed in 1973 judging by the Wehrtechnik issue date). How does that make SkyGuard-M German and should it really go to Germany in-game?
Either way, would be great to see in-game alongside other articulated vehicles. But don’t you dare call Volvo haulers ugly again >:(
IIRC the radar system is Swiss too lol.
The Volvo SM 868 is Swedish no doubt, but the reason why it should go to Germany is due to the Roland, Vulcan and the involvement of the German engineers from Contraves and Oerlikon in this project.
(It was designed and made in Germany)
Also as Germany is already the host for Swiss vehicles, this makes sense.
Haha, acknowledged broski, i wont ever again!
Well your suggestion states that the search and tracking radars are made by Ericsson, a Swedish company that’s today part of Saab. What German engineers were part of this project? Contraves and Oerlikon were Swiss companies at this time so they weren’t really German engineers, Rheinmetall seems to have had nothing to do with it. As far as I can tell the only German part is the Roland missile but even that is half French and there are some pretty strong opinions among some that Swiss stuff should go to France. Maybe it would be a good idea to add voting options for Sweden, France, and maybe for an independent Swiss tree or the other nations category so that it can be treated on the same basis as other Swiss vehicles?
Saab bought most of the shares of the Defence sector of Ericsson in 2006, but that’s even later than RM getting Oerlikon.
The German Oerlikon factory was purchased in 1923 and in 1924 it was making AA applications for sale nationally and internationally. As this experimental vehicle was made (or assembled as the Volvo and the Sky guard are independent systems) in Germany.
It employed Germans to work and design such systems along with Swiss designers.
Literally blasphemous but ok.
And to put the cherry on top, as this is a ‘failed’ project that found no customers until RM took hold, it does own Sky guard as well as Sky guard-M because they are items in inventory as well as purchased stock, by right of which, they go to Germany.
As an example, the Kf-41 Lynx in the Hungary subtree right now is placed on the same kind of principle.
Sorry for not seeing the question lol,
As for the Rolands, they themselves are a good enough option seeing as we got the R1, R2, R3, VT-1 and the HFK-KV.
Although I would rather that it start with the VT-1 as stock and be able to research the HFK-KV later on
Is it possible aswell to replace all missle launchers with guns? 6 gatling guns sounds funny aswell. Maybe another variant at a lower br
I don’t think so… the associated Ammo container needs space under the barrels to be fitted so at max it will be two Vulcans on each side.
ah okay thanks. Would still be cool if it would be selectable if 0, 1 or 2 vulcans should be mounted, but I think no vehicle has something like that yet in warthunder. Probably will be either 0 or 2
Eh knowing Gaijin they’ll only allow it on the left side as the picture shows us that only
I just mentioned Saab for context, Ericsson is a Swedish company, has been since its founding in the late 1800s and definitely was in the 1970s. It has certainly never been Swiss
Oerlikon had a factory in Germany yes but afaik its primary operations were in Switzerland. How do you know the SkyGuard-M was built in Germany? Contraves who developed SkyGuard-M was established in 1936 in Zürich. Contraves only seems to have merged with Oerlikon in 1972/1973 so I’m not even sure they would have had access to Oerlikon’s factory in Germany, if that was even still operational at that time. Even if that’s the case, which I don’t believe it is, it’s still a vehicle made by a Swiss company. Yes there is a German connection but I don’t really think it’s enough to necessarily exclude other options and mark this as a German vehicle. Gaijin has also shown themselves willing to add the same vehicle to multiple trees in certain cases, like with the ITO 90M and the Kürassier
Who owns the rights to the company today is irrelevant or else a significant number of British vehicles would be German in-game since Rheinmetall holds a 55% stake in BAE Land Systems as of 2019. SkyGuard-M at the end of the day is a Swiss vehicle made by a Swiss company. SkyGuard was in use before the Rheinmetall takeover anyway so I don’t see how SkyGuard-M not entering service matters. KF-41 is in the Hungarian subtree because it’s a Hungarian operated vehicle, simple as that
I didn’t say it was lol. Please don’t misrepresent me.
The book sections the Skyguard-M under a German label hence.
Yes, and this shows more Swiss involvement rather than Swedish if I’m being precise.
1993*
Plenty of time imo.
And considering Swiss links with Germany IRL as well as in WT, it makes sense to go to Germany, at least non exclusively. So yes, I do concede that more than 1 nation could get it, but only one nation needs it at its current state.
I sincerely hope so. For Germany’s sake.
Ik but according to my criteria, (arguably useless but just stating for the record to establish my POV) Germany cannot receive those vehicles as Germany, the nation, does not have a development or production or ownership share in those.
RM by itself does have a share but not in the sense of ownership of the vehicles, merely assistance with development and that too being, afaik, less than 30% in many cases for individual vehicles.
Well they are kind of different things considering that Skyguard-M is an integrated system where as the normal one is a tandem system.
So yeah, multiple nations can get it, but Germany needs it. Specifically due to being severely limited to 2 missiles and no close range capability.
My point about the radars was only that you said they were swiss, which would imply that that Ericsson is Swiss, which is not the case.
Since Contraves was a separate Swiss company in 1973 and Oerlikon only had limited (if any?) operations in Germany at the time I’d say the evidence for the SkyGuard-M being built in Germany is very flimsy. Rheimetall owning Oerlikon and Contraves later on really has no relevance in where it should go in-game. Again, there would definitely be a case for putting it in the German tree and I get what you say about Germany needing better SPAA, but assuming that it automatically fits in Germany more than anywhere else is a foregone conclusion as there are at least three trees where it could make sense to be added
Yeah that was my mistake i concede.
The source was actually wrong about the SkyGuard-M having the Ericsson Radar. The standalone Skyguard system using the VELOS radar uses the Ericsson one, while the standard Fire control radar is made by Oerlikon Contraves, ill fix this in the post above now… apologies.
Only other disagreement is about three trees that can get it as France defo cant, Germany and better Germany are the top contenders, and only contenders.
EDIT: after the revelation that ericcson had no part, only switzerland and germany are the contenders
+1 They would need to make a new driving mechanic for it? since its base is unique.
but hell yeah, even if it is as event vehicle only, i would love to see this ingame.
i doubt itll be an event vehicle, SPAA havent been made EVs yet but as for the driving mechanic… its easy as long as gaijin fixes wheel traction smh
Could the “box” where the crew is (aka the skyguard cabin) rotate or was it fixed? Cause seems like it could easily fall off lol
it was fully traversable, and no 😅 it was secured into place via a ‘turret ring’ and traverse system.
Ah got it. Cool find btw, it would give germany a platform which could shoot more than 2 missiles at a time, tho with lower ammo capacity. +1