Responding To Dev Server Feedback Regarding Turret Baskets

[An_Pigeon]

@El_Gran_Capitan

I’m pretty sure the Red Army existed until the collapse of the URSS,

No the red army officially was renamed the soviet army in 1946.

@bertgame

Meanwhile russian dudes hanging ussr flag on their tanks in ukraine. Hmmmm

Which is absolutely abhorrant in of itself and thus further proves my point in asking you to not use the red army statement.

[An_Pigeon]

Exactly, well said.

[El_Gran_Capitan]

Renamed, but was still known as the red army by the soviets. That’s why sometimes you’ll find, during the Cold War era, soviet documents where it says Red Army instead of Soviet army.

[Thodin]

@UniqueScorpions

ERA.

The last 2+ years showed cleary that the ERA concept doesn’t work against modern weapons and drones.

[Baske_74]

Maybe we should get back on topic here!!!

@Smin1080p_WT

the current damage model (without the basket, with more empty space under the turret) penalizes players who hit the center of mass area where there is nothing to damage

This is what i liked about WT compared to WoT, learn where to hit people for OHK or disable the enemy.
The addition of internal components makes the game even more realistic, that should be the goal, not cater to people snap shot center mass and not hitting anything vital. That for me is dumbing down the game

@Smin1080p_WT

we want to avoid penalizing the player who managed to land a shot on the enemy first, reducing those frustrating moments of penetrating a vehicle without doing any meaningful damage

Same thing here reward snap shots , instead of knowledge where critical components are. Again dumbing down the game

@Smin1080p_WT

The floor of the turret basket is not just a metal sheet to walk on, but instead houses all kinds of electrics and hydraulics with means to connect them to the hull

Yes, and these should be modelled and effect the tanks performances, not a basket which only purpose is the mount said internals and keep the crew from mechanical injury and a place to stand

@Smin1080p_WT

damage to the basket can physically deform its elements and prevent normal functioning of the turret drives or damage everything around them if the turret was rotated

Maybe hamper or slow it down, but completely stop a mechanism strong enough to swing a 21 ton turret?

@Smin1080p_WT

implementing new modules takes a lot of time. Whenever there is a change to a vehicle, modules like this are also affected in some way and need to be updated. The issue we’d face here if we modelled them and then left them aside while working on other baskets, is that when the time would come to add everything there would likely be significant changes to the vehicles.

**Plausible, but then test them on the test server not on the live one. this puts two MBT families at a disadvantage when this was implemented. From what i hear in the comments a single piece of schrapnel can now render the turret inoperable, that is a significant “consequence”
And when all the work is done then implement on all MBT’s at the same time.

Also why model internals at such details, taking up development time, but use a two disk damage model for the actual basket? this kind of eye candy for me is not needed since it serves no purpose. or is this an intermediate step towards switching form the “two disk” damage model to the “actual” internals?**

To sum it all up:

• implement changes to better or make the game more “realistic”;

• not make it easier to damage / destroy or incapacitate vehicles with poorly aimed shots;

• that for me has always been the strength of this game knowledge is rewarded;

• Test implementation which effect the players on such a large scale on the Test-server, then implement to all effected, so that no-one has advantage or disadvantage from the changes;

• These changes are now implemented to USA, GER & SWE since they operate predominantly these two MBT types with smaller contingents in the ITA and FRA trees.

• So 3 out of 10 nations are effected;

• This is the second “realism nerf” to the leopard family, talking about the barrel versus engine deck “fix”;

• but where are the actual fixes:
  -C & D - tech armour inserts;
  -loading leopard hull magazine from the top not from the bottom (simple ergonomics)
  -Regenerative steering (been in the works for a long time);
  -Actual used munitions for both MBT’s (M833 & DM33);
  -Why do NATO tanks stop all weapon functions, when FPE is used?
  -Or when crew changes and loaders stop loading and switches to gunner, then starts proces all over again?
  -More for myself, in GFAB i need to research LSR but it doesn’t work as in GFRB?

[bertgame]

@An_Pigeon

Which is absolutely abhorrant in of itself and thus further proves my point in asking you to not use the red army statement.

Damn dude u just said red army was renamed to soviet army. Only name changed bruh. They are not the same thing at all. My god…

[An_Pigeon]

At what point did I say they are not the same thing?

I’ve stated from the start hte red army hasnt been a thing since 1946 and instead was renamed to the soviet army ?

Other than that weve got right off topic.

[UniqueScorpions]

Is that why they slapped era on the abrams? And the cops cage? Kinda weird eh? Doesn’t make much sense if it doesn’t work.

But yes proxy fuse 12.7 or 20mm a are better against drones.

[UniqueScorpions]

Get back on topic to discuss how it was a good change? And now people are salty they got nerfed?

How’s about the fix the auto loader repair times. So they aren’t 30+ secs

Let’s not forget that over time there was going to be a hydraulics leak from the pump for the turret that it would gradually slow down if damaged. Those never got implemented either on the Abrams or Leo’s

[Arctic-Fox]

@UniqueScorpions

60 was the last number i saw in January, they seem to make 3-4 a month.

Where exactly did you get this information? can’t find anything that says they’ve made more than 20 or 30-ish

[Baske_74]

Ah yes, the voice of the opposition.

How long were autoloaders allowed to function, while manual reload wasn’t possible, in case of:

• barrel and or breach damage;
• FPE activation;
• loader killed, which really drops the reload south of 10sec;
• crew swap, where loader dropped the shells switch seats and then went back;

For any manual loader to receive max speed, you need: max crew skills in reload and command and purchase Expert (1.120.000 SL) or ACE (1.430.000 RP or 2300 GE), which leo2 needs to be faster then T-80 (6.5s) loader. A thing autoloaders don’t have to do, granted would help other stats but not reload.

If you think repair is to long, make a topic about it.

While not at top tier USSR, currently at T80B, Object 292, etc, having aced all T-72 series before that i can say, they can take quite a beating and never had much issues with the autolader. Sure zooming around in a Type 90 or Type 10p is more fun, but they have nowhere near the power to push towards an objective, armor is non-existant.

[bertgame]

@An_Pigeon

No the red army officially was renamed the soviet army in 1946.

U answered the other guy with this bruh😑

[bertgame]

Right… So u are a dude that has a family and doesnt want o die. Even if it doesnt work they will surely take it no matter what

[Conte_Baracca]

@Smin1080p_WT

We want to note that important elements such as electrics and hydraulics are all located in and around the basket area and all provide some power to the drives and turret in different ways.

Not really. Those sensitive components are maybe 5% of the surface area of the turret basket.

@Smin1080p_WT

In addition to the point above about why baskets affect turret rotation, damage to the basket can physically deform its elements and prevent normal functioning of the turret drives or damage everything around them if the turret was rotated.

This is also a gross simplification. The turret on the Abrams, for example, often rips pieces off the turret basket. When it does this the tank continues to function normally. The hydraulics operate at 1500-1700 psi, the basket is not strong enough to stand up to that.

A USMC veteran on the M1A1 Abrams tank: “This tank was designed for assault!” - News - War Thunder

I know what I’m talking about. Basically you are providing inaccurate and ignorant justifications. If you are doing this for balance, fine. But it has nothing to do with realism. Don’t try and hide behind that please.

[An_Pigeon]

Whats your point? thats literally what ive been saying this whole time?

EDIT: What you have said, and are also saying makes zero sense at all.
and also absolutely off topic so isntead of getting locked or muted, enough is enough

[bertgame]

😑
U said that red army WASNT soviet army
😑

[Thenighthunter]

What’s better is this gem is left alone and still present.
https://community.gaijin.net/issues/p/warthunder/i/N56mDqoohdMa

[Conte_Baracca]

groans audibly

[jayn1thejet]

I hate this change as well and never clamored for it. Why would anyone ever learn aim if no matter where you place your shots your guaranteed to disable something? It’s making the game more like call of duty where no matter how bad your aim is who ever gets the first shot in wins

Most people’s caveats to no no damage hits fell squarely on the snail’s spaghetti code( or hidden tweaks and modifiers)which will still happen btw regardless if there is a component there or not

[Conte_Baracca]

@jayn1thejet

I hate this change as well and never clamored for it.

It’s also INCREDIBLY fake. Just pure fantasy. It’s not how it works in the Abrams at all.