I play sim, 9M being actually invisible and having the better IRCCM (in my opinion) is huge. R73 of course has the thrust vectoring which is nice but it’s way too easy to flare. I understand if you prefer the 9M though, “many times better” is an exaggeration though.
You can still notch it… You just can’t go in a perfectly straight line at a constant speed after the notch if it’s close… Just divert a little and you’ll be fine.
@HighRiskNoReward
How about instead of having posts that push hate and twist the words of NATO fans, you provide constructive posts instead…
Just cause you imply the vast majority of the community are gaslighters just cause I agree with them and repeat their factual statements doesn’t mean you should say it out loud.
Seriously, you should just speak on a different language forum if you’re just going to accuse most of the English forum of nasty things.
in sim anything is almost certain death on top tier however on ARB r73 has the upper hand because 9m can be seen and flared from any distance, r73 when fired close or when it gets too close is impossible to dodge or flare, 9m irccm isnt even good its literally flare and turn and it wont hit
with r27er its much harder to notch and at the same time change direction and not get locked again
realism is fine by me, but you got to admit gaijin did a massive blunder by adding this missile so soon.
one little element some tend to forget is that this missile came online roughly at the same time as amraam (1990 for R27ER, 1991 for AIM-120A)
for reference, aim7m is 1982, legacy R27 is 1985, and 530D is 1987, and i think those 3 are quite well balanced between each other
R27ER could have come with early fox3s, to give a long range alternative, and a shorter range fox3 (r77).
TBH i don’t really think R27ER is going to stay an issue for long with the addition of more advanced missiles in june
like either of these missiles are “meta” when you can do silly manuevres with the plane and they stop tracking or you outturn them completely.
Fun fact both missiles were ready to use st same time except the r27er was meant to be used with newest jet of the time su27 so it was postponed untill it was released
obviously the missile themselves “existed” before.
But i’m comparing apple to apples : ie when each missile comes into service for each air force, on any airframe available
It was used on smaller scale before 1991 as well so the date that it was introduced in that year does not matter
And the first (successful) air launch of an AMRAAM was in 1987, the first attempt either late 85 or early 86; your point?
if we are talking realism, date matters as much as the rest
now don’t get me wrong, i’m not in favor of a date based mm, for obvious reasons, but that missile was an abnormality that came late compared to other SARHs IRL
Gaijin could and should have refrained from adding it that early in their game, it would have made sense both in terms of balance and realism
It didn’t came late tho it came at the same time base r27er became a thing
it came after all other Fox1s. It was basically the last SARH to be put in active service.
no, 9m has almost 0% chance of hit if enemy is aware. Missile literally turns into a dumb stick after you pop a flare
r73 when it gets close has 100% chance of hit
it wont be when those new missiles get added, but its just pure stupidity it was added in december 2022
this missile was dominating top tier for 1.5 years now
Yeah, I don’t get where everyone is getting it’s so amazing. It’s constantly losing lock even 1-2km rear aspect. 3 flares and a sharp turn and bye bye…
The funny part about this is, not everyone can fly low, or the situation at hand disallows it. That is where the ER works well. The ER is fast enough and maneuverable enough to kill someone who has to pop up above the multipathing layer, whether they are having to go defensive or not. Another thing… that isn’t the only way to dodge an ER, you can bleed its energy which is hard but again isn’t impossible. Infact the F-14 with its Phoenix can actually now outrange a ER. However how often is anyone engaging in a proper BVR duel in random battles. Most likely less than 1% of the playerbase.
You can’t expect me to remember every radar missile name it is the one on the new Mirage that was added. That thing is more of a baby ER, but becomes far more maneuverable once it gets up to speed. and it is only second to the ER which the Sparrow isn’t even close to the same level.
Those sources are Russian, you do know that Russia overstates their techs capabilities while NATO sources understate them. Not to mention Russian Sources are extremely unreliable. Like Wikipedia is more reliable than Russian Sources.
It really isn’t if you both have to use it in that situation you aren’t good pilots. Probably explains why you all think the Sparrow is on par, when in reality it isn’t you can dodge them so easily it is like child’s play.
I would love to say my piece on this specifically however I guarantee you if I did I would be banned. Though the information on it isn’t hard to find.
Most other missiles are dodge able without multipath abuse. Sparrows are by far the easiest. Take a Flanker out against an F-15 and do some actual BVR and see who kill who first. (Hint, its the Flanker unless that F-15 Pilot can consistently notch your radar.) The ER and by proxy the Flanker/Fulcrum Radar is very hard to notch, and if you don’t do it perfectly you die, unless you can out energy the missile. Hence Multipath Abuse is the only good way to avoid an ER. Which as I stated before, isn’t always an option. Due to either the flow of battle, or the tree hitboxes being weirdly big. or just map makers forgetting what altitude a tree is meant to be (Kamchatka is a good example of that, as well as the Alaska Map).
Tell me you are getting whacked by 9Ms without telling me you are getting whacked by 9Ms. Simple solution to your problem preflare them, as it will actually disable the seeker before launch. Also no the R-73 modeled in game doesn’t have a smaller FoV radii that would be the next variant. Also the R-73s don’t need a buff, you can point blank a person with them. (It is really funny.)
Yeah kinda all ready figured that, wouldn’t be to surprised if MiG_23M is his alt.
Please stop lying, I will literally go look at every time you have died to an SARH missile and list them out with each replay, as cool bug facts that is public.
That is a straight up lie, this is how I know you are either the worst RU main to ever exist or you have several mental defects. Please consult a psychiatrist and be medicated.
Such as?
Super 530 is outperformed by the AIM-7F/M.
They are the primary technical documents and test data, not claimed performance. It is most certainly not overstated propaganda because it was not public. It was documentation available to Moscow aviation institute for study of aerospace and defense. The R-27 series and R-73 series is very well understood.
I assure you, I’m a better pilot in the game than you are. We never said the Sparrow was on par. On paper, it’s not. In practice it is just as useless due to multipath.
I don’t see how you’d be banned. If you had information showing the primary materials to be wrong feel free to share.
So take two planes and put them in a situation where one is going to win… see the results? Weird.
Now take them both and have them skim … who is gonna win? Likely the AIM-9M slinger.
I’m not getting “whacked”. I have all top tier fighters (except British), and I’ve played the game for more than 15,000 hours. What I’m saying requires none of that for proof. You can test and ascertain which is better if you’d like. The AIM-9M scores guaranteed kills in a much wider range of launch conditions than the R-73.
Oh, and no. The R-73 in-game (RMD-1) has a FoV that is too large. As does the Magic 2.
You must be new here if you think I’m an alt account for someone else.
SARH missiles have a guaranteed 100% reliable defense (skimming)… IR missiles do not. What he said is logically sound. You refuse to acknowledge or admit that SARH use is only possible when the enemy isn’t abusing the meta play (skimming).
Tell us you’re losing the argument without saying so directly …
You know what i dont get? Assuming that you know how the flare rejection on an AIM9M works, i dont get why you are surprised when a rear aspect shot makes the missile miss.
Both the AIM9M and R73 have advantages and disadvantages.
They have very different use cases.
Due to the nature of their IRCCM systems, the R73 is more of a close range / rear aspect missile, while the AIM9M is more useful in long range shots.
The AIM9M is best used in side-aspect shots, at ranges where the target cannot turn either front/rear aspect to trick the seeker shut-off.
The R73 is best used at close ranges, where its FOV Clamp style IRCCM makes it so that it is very difficult ( but still doable ) to place a flare between the seeker and the Target.
Of course the AIM9M doesn’t behave well if you arent using it in situations where its strong.
530D is absolutely horrible, don’t let the “top speed” on the stat card fool you.
530D accelerates faster than 7M while being a bit more maneuverable. Its cruise engine burns for far less however (10s total burn vs 16s) and it’s less aerodynamic it feels like.
Both are very different and yet pretty balanced against each other. ER is totally different though