Rafale's reign in a top-tier RB?

Machinery of War Discussion Aircraft
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121

i know about Bug-report,… CCIP and radar on etendard IVM took 3 years to get implemented, despite using primary sources,…

i know about it, i made it.

but it’s Gaijin that is in command,… there might be an unseen reason.
They model aircraft based on what they have (and most of time, nothing is accurate)

There is several Bug-report to both Buff and nerf Rafale historically, as there is for every other aircraft of the game.

but the reality is there, and F.3R it is, so F.3R is the basis of every changes that Gaijin have made about Rafale, while following their own rules → if a vehicule could do it and it’s documented, then it gets it despite IRL reality.

And there is EF-2000 that needs actual Gaijin improvement (specifically on Brimstone ARH seekers, as discussed)

Gaijin also knows that there is a lot of potential variants to add for several nations, in the several years:
USA:
F-15C/E → F-15EX
F-16C → F-16V
F-14B → F-14D (kinda DOA, but still possible)
F-18C → F-18E
before introduction of 5th gens: F-22 / F-35’s

Russia:
Su-27SM3 → Su-35BM → Su-35S
Su-30SM → Su-30SM2 → Su-30
MiG-29 SMT → MiG-29K → MiG-33 (prototype : could be skipped) → MiG-35
then Su-57 and Su-75

China:
J-10A → J-10C
J-11B → J-11 BG (AESA radar)
then 5th gens: J-20 and FC-31

Other countries will rely on US Stuff mostly (improved variants and F-35’s), maybe some indian one for UK, and SK/asian for Japan,… but that’s it.

To all other hypocrites, i still wanted to get only a M F.1 Late, and C F.2.2 Rafale (not a C F.3R which is better than current counterparts, on that i agree)

122

Problem is that Gen 5 ir missiles will be some of the least fun stuff in game, anyone with an asraam r74m2 or mica ir will just launch on anyone from like 15 km and it will be likely a guaranteed kill, so I doubt we will those any time soon. Instead we will likely still stay with the current ir missile generation and just upgrade the fox 3s

123

Rafale still gonna outperform those 2 simply because MICA. Unless Meteor will get some unique seeker that will make it difficult to notch it won’t change much. Sure Eurofighter and Gripen will be less blind and maybe even capable to beat Rafale in a merge, overall meta won’t shift much, rest of the player base will just have 2 more impressive airframes instead of balance

124

Just like they’ve done with Aim-9Ms. Im guessing they will artificially limit lock ranges for balance.

But I still think ASRAAM vs MICA IR would be substantially more balanced than Aim-9M vs Magic II is right now

125

Magic-2 also could get a lock range buff,… Magic-2 wasn’t called “poor man’s IRST” for nothing.
this isn’t only AIM-9M (but we have to conform to the R-73, you know)

2 Likes
126

Except, it shouldnt. Thats the problem. AMRAAM A/B & C5s have multiple outstanding bug reports. IRIS-T and ASRAAM would massively equally the imbalance in WVR

Almost every aspect of the Typhoon is underperforming right now and the gap between the Rafale and the Typhoon should be much smaller. If anything, the Typhoon should be the stronger of the 2 airframes,

If MICA remains totally OP, then simply reduce the Rafale down to its IRL MICA EM count of 6 instead of the current ahistorical 8 it can carry

127

Give R-27ET its lock range and terminal phase DL and you don’t have to conform to R-73.

128

can’t really, thanks to that, and to Yak-141.

129

The difference though, is that, the IRCCM on the Aim-9M favours longer range shots whereas Magic II favour closer shots (especially given the Aim-9M is useless up close) and the kinematic range on the Magic II also seems shorter. I’ve never had an issue getting a lock with a magic II when I actually wanted to fire it. Meanwhile i’ve had the Aim-9M within the LSZ but couldnt fire due to no lock.

130

Then the Brochures from the manufactorers and pilot testimony should be enough for the Typhoon to get its 6+6 or 2+8 weapons fit.

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Do you have footage? because from my experience i never had trouble to lock a 9M on anything (F-15A and F-15J)

132

Those are considered secondary sources no?

the Actual 8 missiles on Rafale is much more documented, if i recall.

133

R27et never had datalink. All it got were upgraded seekerheads for lobl

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The issue is most pronounced against non-AB targets. Though even then, the ability to fire at even greater ranges with the smokeless motor would allow you to catch targets off-guard

The report covering lock ranges:

https://community.gaijin.net/issues/p/warthunder/i/PX7CKrwWNGdr

Front aspect vs max power should be 5 times greater than it currently is

Use to happen all the time back when the Gripen C was first added to the point that it was one of the main reasons I stopped playing the Gripen C. Drove me nuts that I had 0 BVR and my IR missiles basically didnt work in front aspect

1 Like
135

Unfortunately, yes, the manufactorer of the Typhoon is considered a Secondary Source by Gaijin. Which is really annoying, as there are multiple reports that got denied because the manufactorer was considered unrealiable and only released “marketing lies”

136

leaflets and actual manuals are 2 different things in gaijin mind.

137

and the actual manuals are all classified for the Typhoon.

Half the docs used for the CAPTOR-M are actually for the Blue Vixen

138

i’m uploading video about Magic-2 right now, but in similar situation and approach, i’ve got a lock at 2.6km.

in your video, the timer of the missile broke, but got a lock at 2km on the MiG-15

Now considering that AIM-9M got an all aspect lock at 3km, and that Magic-2 Got an all-aspect lock at 3.4km (statcards), it seems that performances are “fine” by comparison.

139

same for Rafale not gonna lie.

140

R-27 missiles are modular and use same exact control module on every single version. Only difference is engine module and seeker module.