In a game where most encounters are decided by who fires disabling/killing shot first, having ability to lay gun on the enemy earlier is massive advantage no matter the rank.
1 Like
Sigh…
The stat card is showing me a different value than the crew cards:
I have, I used the Armour Analysis tool to account for that.
1 Like
Not the first time I’ve seen this to be honest.
Probably has turned into a game feature at this point. 😂
1 Like
The armor is pretty good for 3.3. Particular the the turret front and side.
A change to structural steel would be a big hit to bounce shots at an angle.
Maybe in a downtier, but most tanks between 3.3 and 4.3 will laugh at that armor. And what angle? If someone is shooting you, you must be ready to shoot back, which implies keeping the gun, and therefore the turret front, towards the enemy.
Eh, not really.
It’s only 12.7 mm thick RHA. Yes, structural steel is much weaker than RHA in warthunder (0.45x multiplier if I’m not mistaken), but the actually affected armor is very thin to the change isn’t much. You’d lose 7 mm in effectiveness.
The Panzer 4s definitely don’t need a br increase because they’re just not that good imho. They have poor armor, poor mobility, and usually explode on the first hit because of how compact the crew and ammo are. Literally the only thing they have going for them is the gun, but even then that thing can be iffy with its low explosive filler and its honestly a bit overkill for the BR. You can’t angle them because people can shoot through your 40mm sides.
The T-34-76 has everything the Panzer 4 series doesn’t. A trolly volumetric trap turret that can bounce a nuclear missile, angled hull, a lot of mobility, and a gun that has good angle performance and a lot of explosive filler.
3 Likes
People can shoot you when you are not looking at them, or maybe you can not shoot but still want to make it hard for them to pen you.
If someone glances your tank more armor can safe you, even when it’s generally not enough.
The Cromwell can also face a lot of AA from the front without having to worry about getting penetrated, like the T-34 or Pz IV.
Of course it’s also helpful in downtiers.
7mm is actually a lot. That’s like 10% of current protection.
That’s like saying Tiger losing 10mm at the front armor is not a big deal.
Can make the difference of being penetrated at 100m or 500m or at 15° or 30° angle.
1 Like
Achilles/M10 are both open-top and are tied for the worst turret rotation in the game.
1 Like
Italian Pz-IV G is a pseudo Pz-IVH , with the same gun and similar turret armour. Only difference is it doesnt get the side skirts. Ita Pz-IV has 145mm pen just like the Pz-IV H, unlike Pz-IVG’s 138mm.
Everyone is getting off topic lol.
1 Like
Honestly, Panzer IV has decent enough armour, I’ve had Shermans struggling to pen me at 100+ meters.
It’s generally great in my opinion, not the best but not the worst.
Not really an issue when everything else is a 1 hit.
Doesn’t matter about the filler because if you aim right it’s a 1 shot, if not you will have 100% crippled the enemy,
In my Honest opinion, I feel as if the T-34’s, Panzer 4’s and Shermans (contemporary variants) are all equal really, and that the German Pz 4 G should be 3.7, and the Pz H/J really should go to 4.0. This is all from personal experience, I have all of the mentioned vehicles and spaded all the German ones. The German L48 are very effective at ranges, and can very reliably one tap or cripple T-34’s and Shermans frontally. Shermans have a very nice turret, yet lackluster cannon/armour but with good positioning this doesn’t matter much. T-34’s have trolly armour and are very swift.
They are literally each other’s scissor paper rock.
Shermans thick armour makes it hard for T-34, T-34 mobility counter Pz-IV’s less responsiveness and Pz-IV out gun Shermans armour.
1 Like
Were they using M61? or APCR?
Skill issue mate
APHEBC will not have issues dealing with Pz-IV’s turret. Gyro Stab also helps a lot. You should never aim for flat armour of Pz-IV, aim for the sides and turret.
1 Like
Please tell me how great the Panzer IV’s armor is, I can guarantee they have never been air-strafed to death by cannon/machinegun fire…
The German T-34 has a 20% higher win rate and 2.5x kills per death than the regular Panzer 4s.
Panzer 4s are quite easy to kill compared to Shermans and T-34s which can be nightmares if played by good people.
1 Like
Large, flat 50mm turret face means every PzKpfw IV variant has terrible armour, that’s not even mentioning the paper thin sides or the transmission cover that any Russian 76 can penetrate at any distance.
The fact that the turret is weaker than the hull also means it can’t effectively hull-down unlike the Sherman, which has double the turret armour.
Out of the Sherman, Cromwell, T-34 and Pz IV, it plainly has the worst mobility.
The difference is that the T-34 and Sherman don’t have to ‘‘aim right’’ because their massively higher post-pen damage result in much easier one-hit-kills.
The Sherman is also stabilized, has 50. cals, twice the turret traverse, better gun depression and a faster reload.
4 Likes
I don’t want to get into this hell whole of a thread, but I’ve died to strafing in many much more armored tanks… Such as the M26/T26’s, Tigers, Shermans… Ect. Ect…