Those who know (:insert cringy troll face picture:)
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Would have really liked to see that thing in the Italian tree as I personally would have thought that it fits better into that one. Especially considering that the base version of the plane is already there and this is a western upgrade programme for it mainly developed by France
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The Orao and Vultur are very different. It is not the base. The base Orao also had flares later on unlike the Vultur.
No? The weapons, systems, and pretty much everything are Serbian made with few exceptions such as some weapons from Yugo times that still have not been upgraded.
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100 percent agree with that. I really hope they don’t just decide to push it into the USSR tree. Seems a bit, odd.
10.7 is it not? but it’ll likely end up at 11.0 due to te loadout.
It’s gonna end up 11.0 or such mate, R60s, Afterburner, CMs, RWR. as well as Mavs and groms.
IT cannot be sat bellow an AMX A1A surely xD which is 11.3 with only GBUS.
Hoping hte same, shame it’s such a unique plane as well.
Genuinely best Idea would be to put India into Russia for the most part, most their planes, tanks etc in the early 2000’s and such are either based off of, or are russian.
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As much as we all share the same glaring issue with it being in Russian TT. lets all just rejoice in the fact that its the closest so far (not including the IAR) to a Yugo vehicle
Lets hope in the future if it is visibly popular to see more yugo stuff like the J-21/G2 and G4
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I for one am glad to at least see it mate, it’s gonna be suhc a good plane and will definitely be a handy / nice addition for the game
They should really make an Eastern Europe Tech Tree. It would cover a lot of bases and wouldn’t be the punch to the face adding to Russia or the West would be. The small part of me that is Eastern European hates the Idea of getting added to Russia.
However, I am more excited about this than the F-14D at the moment.
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I dont believe it currently has them, but I think it should get them cause otherwise its like a 9.0 gunfighter that isnt very good at gunfighting and i think it would work better at 9.3/9.7 with r60s, but ig gaijin’s intention is to basically have it be a combined battle only vehicle
Its advertised with them.
If one pre orders the plane ans it has no R60s, (unless they tweaked the add) it’s false advertisement
i think gaijin have explicitly advertised it without them if anything
you arent stuck to playing defensive if you have a-a missiles
though ones of its ATGMs (VRVZ-240) is pretty quick and while it doesnt have proxy it might still be good for catching some people unaware
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No
We should get a Yugoslav tech tree
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Read it again, it seems to be missing something lol.it says
- Several types of air-to-surface guided missiles, including the advanced GROM-B
- Missiles, bombs, and a ballistic computer
What the hell was the 2nd reference to missiles about, also i may have mixed up bit im sure it was advertised with R60s
Like i may be getting mixed up bear in mind.
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If it gets R-60’s I think it should at least be 10.0 in ARB if it gets R60m’s even 10.3, especially 9.3 would be far to low
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I don’t think they will give it r60s. There currently is no 10.7 premium cas to support the 10.7 premium lineup, so gaijin has an incentive to keep it there after launch. Currently, ignoring mitl capacity, it is balanced at 10.7. Compared to the AJS for example which trades the thermal imagining and long range capacity for maneuverability and air to air ordinance. The a10a late suffers even more in this regard for more ordinance and gets aim9ls. After testing it out, it cruises around 900km/hr with a little straightaway somewhat easily, so it lives in a middle ground of sorts. It’s normal fnf missiles still require some proximity to the target, so the thermal pod won’t maximize its utility like you can with IR weaponry.
MITL missiles, however, make this plane go from balanced to insane, but due to the fact that many many aircraft get them, similar to harms, gaijin won’t rebalance them all and uptier a ton of aircraft → so I’m assuming they won’t have much impact.
But who knows it’s gaijin for all I know they’ll slap 2 r60s on it and call it a day.
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You and I know it’ll likely move up anyways as it has a rather large ammount of CP and has good ground attack capabilities.
It’ll still give it one hell of a longer range though in aquiring targets I guess we’ll have to wait and see.
We may see man, if they slam this into 10.7 and it can detect the 11.7 SPAA radars it may be an absolute menace.
I’m honestly not sure how they plan to balance it. Purely looking at the ground attack ordinance, agm65bs aren’t insane at 10.7. It really is mostly just the thermal pod doing the work → but the a10alate also gets therms in its agm65d seekers (though they are very rudimentary); the MITL weapons are the kicker, but I don’t think gaijin will rebalance it because of the MITL factor. Normally, if there’s an OP cas plane that also has some air to air capabilities, it will move up slightly. But this plane effectively puts all of its points into ground attack ordinance, leaving it effectively offenseless if anyone decided to go for you, (it does get a lot of countermeasures so it will likely survive some initial beatings however).
It is the highest plane in warthunder above its air RB br in GRB, and I am not sure how much gaijin values it. For example, without the MITL weapons, I would probably still take the AJS over this, as due to its maneuverability you can sort of “play around” with the spaa a lot, and then come down above from outside of its range. The countermeasures are nice, but they normally have minimal effect against 10.7 spaa, and if your fast enough, you can escape most 10.7 aerial threats.
This thing will be an absolute menace though due to the MITL weaponry. You can fly high at 15-20km out (at 10.7 mind you), fire off 1 kosava 3tm at the enemy spawn (TV + IOG + GNSS), and guide it in to the spaa on the ground with help from your planes thermals whilst still cruising outside the range of the spaa. This gameplay style is really unheard of in warthunder. Before this update, if you wanted to do a strategy from complete immunity, such as lobbying unguided rockets from heli spawn, or GNSS spamming kh38s from the runway, they had limited effectiveness → and the core gameplay did not cater to it.
After the MITL update, the core gameplay for helicopters consists of lobbying MITL lmurs, cm502kgs, and spike ERs out of heli spawn, and then guiding them into targets/spaa with 0 risk. Planes can also do this, but top tier spaa can normally scare them off to a decent distance, reducing the effectiveness of guiding 1 ordinance in at a time, but at 10.7 there is no threat, and you can simply cruise until an enemy aircraft spawns in for revenge, at which point you can run away, loop your airfield, or most likely just die.
The closest comparison we get is the A-6E tram. It also gets a thermal imaging pod, but has much better angles (the J-22 can only really aim it frontally). If it spends 3-4 minutes climbing altitude, it can then use its laser-guided weaponry to also attack spaa from “immunity”. The J-22 is a little faster, but loses all access to air to air weaponry in exchange for rudimentary tv guided weaponry. In this specific scenario, everything is balanced, but then MITL comes in. It can do the same thing the A-6E can, but from low altitudes, without needing to expose yourself (even if outside the range of the spaa). It is just objectively better, but its due to a new mechanic, not just because of its thermals or maneuverability. I personally don’t see gaijin moving every new vehicle with MITL up; in fact I would hope they would remove the Kosova 3tm from the J22, which would make it balanced at 10.7 before they decide to just move it up.
With MITL indirect attacks, the only way to “balance” is through the plane fighting spaa which can fairly easily pick up the missile on radar, and intercept it, which begin to be prominent around 11.7. But its still a 9.0 airframe effectively with no air to air; and I believe gaijin likes to balance air to air and air to ground performance in GRB battle ratings.
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You never know mate, they are overhauling how a lot of guided munitions owrk this patch.
not always the case there’s a su25 with R73s at 10.7 mate, it’s completely dependant on how well it performs ground attack wise (as well as how people do with it), You cannot tell me this thing can be 10.7 but the AMX A1A has to be 11.3 with only GBUs.
the countermeasures work against most SPAA at those BRs, chaff does help break locks, even for a moment.
this is what I mean will move it up even the super etendard with AS 30s is at 11.0 and it only has about 11km range.
If this has 15-20km it’ll end up in teh 11.7 range.
You can do that with a few vehicles like the Jaguar A for france or super etendard due to the decent targetting pods and over 11km range missiles.
but yeah it’s not that common.
The A6E though is a boat in comparisson to this, though has the Skippers which are nice and fun to use in my latest experience.
Thats the thing, the mavs aren’t that strong, the MITL is.
far easier to move it up than remove weapons it has access to IRL.
it’s air frames not that bad is it? thought it was meant to be quite nippy.
in GRB they tend to balance based off of the ground strike capability oppose to the air to air capabilities.
Hence why they brought the distinction of BRs between Air and Ground in the first place.
For a lot of CAS planes that appear to be over tiered, it’s because they have some air to air weaponry or maneuverability that is relatively good. This is what leads me to believe that gaijin does value air to air weaponry in grb. For example, fighters in grb are still balanced off of their air to air weaponry until top tier where they receive both air to air and air to ground, and recently gaijin reworked seperate sp pools for aircraft. They view strike and fighter aircraft more as platforms, with brs and sp cost based off of weapons and maneuverability (the j22 struggles a bit in this regard). Now, you can say the air to air missiles the amx gets aren’t worth the br increase, but my point is that the “label” of an aircraft doesn’t actually matter that much in balancing. I personally believe that the AMX is more of a victim of the minor nation effect (better players can make anything work, so gaijin doesn’t believe it needs a buff even if it objectively struggles relative to peers). The primary reason for different brs I believe is to condense aircraft into a 13.0 br range from a 14.7 range, and then decent ground loadouts will push it upwards slightly. They aren’t quite looking at specific ordinance capabilities to each other as much as they are looking at its air rb br and then collective performance in addition to its ground ordinance. So the fundamental determinant is air to air performance in air rb, but specific ordinance can have substantial influence. So even if a “strike” aircraft’s loadout isn’t that good, it is first balanced as a fighter in air rb, and then adjustments are made; which again is insane that the amx has a higher grb rating because it should be lower if anything.
According to this balancing formula, gaijin will likely keep the J22 at 10.7 for a bit, before maybe raising it to a maximum of 11.0 if the players do really good in it (their favorite way to balance aircraft). But it lacking any air to air capacity, along with having limited maneuverability, especially with the weight of the MITL ordinance, will fundamentally cap the maximum br gaijin is willing to put it at.
It will be crazy with MITL, but I could easily see gaijin justifying keeping it at 10.7 for a good few months for the initial revenue from the 10.7 premium lineup due to its lackluster air to air capacity beyond being an air to ground missile bus.
My point generally boils down to: With MITL, I agree that it does belong at 11.0, but there has never been a feature like it added before to an aircraft already so high above its air rb br, so I struggle to assume gaijin is competent enough to move it to 11.0 without any resistance.
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Su30MKK is 12.3 mate, and it can carry 6x KH29s, 2 R73s and 2 PL12s-
EF2000 is 13.0 but has significantly worse loadouts yet is higher BR.
They do obviously include the A2A capabilities, but the J22 has extremely strong Ground strike capabilities which allows it to outrange most SPAA which, will likely move it up in BR.
I’ll agree here, i reckon it’ll end up a bit higher, i can’t help but ocmpare it to the AmX A1A which sure has access to 2 Pirhana missiles but they’re not really that good at all.
and it’s 11.3
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