No one suggested Gripen E be 14.0, so it’s a useless thing to state.
24 nerfs to Russia
7 nerfs to USA
9+ German nerfs
14+ British buffs
someone is showing their bias.
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planes 8 (F-15C GE), 9 (EF-2000(AESA)) and 10 (F-2000A) also have a very comparable K/D to the J-10C.
Which implies that these planes (2 of which are staying at 14.3 for now) are comparable and are more than fine at the same BR as the J-10C.
It has a higher KS than the non-AESA typhoon
so why should it go down?
The main issue for the J-10C is the fact that gaijin (for some unholy reason) decided to add new top tier planes that are direct upgrades over existing variants at the same br as them
which completely screwed over its performance
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the Tiger 2 already struggles against T32s and IS4Ms it does not need to be 8.0 especially since its already been nerfed should we raise the IS2 1944 and T26e1-1 and E5 aswell ?
this is just bias we just need decompression at the br
lets just uptier one vehicle instead of the fixing the problems of the br Ahh post
panther D is fine at 5.3 simply due to its horrible turret traverse
the panzer 4H and J are completely fine at 3.7 as they are not firefly equivalents the firefly has way better armor and has chance of bouncing the round of the panzer 4 the panzer 4 has zero chance
meteors are completely fine i love them they are among the strongest of there brs and have ZERO right being similar brs to a 262
and if they raise the br of the T34s shermans have to go up too as there just as strong
All aircraft suffer from the same issue; no top-tier aircraft is complete or close to being so.
And? I’m not really seeing your point.
Can’t even like this post cause I ran out of likes.
last I checked Rafale doesn’t seem to be struggling
not gonna lie, i would kill to have the ozelot’s search on something like the sidam mistral, machbet, or type 93.
also from what ive found any gun that is below 30mm in caliber seems to have their rounds despawn around 2km anyway, so kills with the gun on something like the machbet or sidam mistral are on drones or at point blank (obviously still useful, but mostly for emergencies or saving missiles)
It remains incomplete, even though the stats are better, but statistics in games like War Thunder depend on skill, so…
Thats a thing ?
This list is created by:
1. Vehicle effectiveness
2. What the vehicle may see as opposition
3. It’s capabilities
USA:
T77E1 3.7 > 3.3 (it is purely a slightly better armored m16 GMC with 2 additional guns. Shouldn’t need a 1.0 br gap.)
M19a1 4.0 > 3.7 (better than the T77E1 if your aim is really good, but often isn’t a great SPAA.)
Skink 5.3 > 5.0 (good armor for an SPAA but the very limited belt size shouldnt set it at 5.3, 5.0 is optimal)
T1E1(90) 5.7 > 6.0
Being a weakly armored vehicle, people largely ignore, a 90mm, an auxiliary 37mm, and 3 50cal machine guns. It has very good mobility, good penetration, a lot of crew and good APHE. Even for its bad armor, it has a lot of trolly spots, where shells can non pen. It is far too strong for 5.7 and consistently is used to bully enemies due to its pros.
T20 6.3 > 6.0 (it’s by far a worse T25 at a higher br for some strange reason, and I don’t think a low speed vertical stabilizer is sufficient for a higher br.)
T92 7.0 > 7.3 (Tends to bounce or eat shells, fast, small, very easy to bush and hide, potent HEATFS)
T26E5 6.7 > 7.0 (7.3 quality armor at 6.7, with a good reload and good penetration being better than most 6.7s with ease)
T34 6.7 > 7.0 (spreading out the heavy tanks, getting better rewards, but good gun / armor. Able to pierce anything, while blocking many hits. 5.7s can hardly kill it, same as T26E5)
T30 6.7 > 7.0 (better T34 at the same BR, with a larger cannon, good pen, insane HE filler, able to overpressure many tanks easily.)
M551(76) 7.0 > 7.3 (stabilized very potent light tank, with a decent damage APDS, than can kill every 6.7-7.3 frontally with ease).
T29 7.0 > 7.3 (A go to, to bully tanks, great from 6.0 - 7.7, most 6.0-6.3 tanks hardly can kill these T34, T30 included, good reload and great penetration with APHE, it also has 3x .50cal HMGs, two of which are coax).
M50 6.7 > 7.3 (small size, quiet engine, ability to rapid fire 6 rounds, very easy to bush up).
T54E2 (12% reload speed buff).
T58 8.3 > 9.0 (a very broken HEAT round, with a very broken 2.6 sec load time, with GREAT armor, and GREAT turret traverse, and can quite literally kill anything above its br, and it murders 7.3s which have no chance against it.)
Germany:
VK30.02 5.0 > 5.3 (should never have been able to see 4.0 tanks no matter how bad its turret traverse is. Also way too powerful of a gun for 4.0-4.7 with armor to match).
Panther D 5.3 > 5.7 (makes sense as a step up from the VK being 5.3, while having better armor).
2 Tiger pack OST/west 5.7 > 6.0 (preforming well, add on armor drastically increases survivability, with a good cannon).
Panther F 6.0 > 6.3 (three folders panthers at the same br doesn’t make a lot of sense, the turret armor is also somewhat better than the other panthers, with a harder to snipe barrel.)
Tiger II (H)s 6.7 > 7.0 (USA heavy dispersion happening, thus Germany gets it too, and the Tiger II is equal to the T34, and T30 in terms of performance).
Tiger II 10.5 CM 7.0 > 7.3 (devastatingly good gun, with a harder to hit turret face, due to bigger cannon breech)
Pzh2000 7.7 > 8.0 (even with no thermal, by far the best arty in game with a 5.0 sec auto loader for the first 4 rounds, subsequent loads are 7.5 secs )
Df105 8.0 > 8.3 (10 shot HEAT mag, with a 5 sec load time, can bounce early APFSDS, and eats auto cannon rounds).
Raketenautomat 8.0 > 8.3 (massive magazine of devastating ammo, with great pen and low drop).
RakJPz 2 (HOT) 8.3 > 8.7 (being practically equal to the IT-1 in its ability to hide behind hills and not take damage, while having a better atgm for less armor.)
Gepard 8.3 > 8.7 (often used to zoom to a flank and wipe half a team due to great APHE, and it’s APDS can kill the heaviest of tanks, also way too good of an aa for just 8.3, it can easily down helicopters, and planes with ease).
Turm III 8.3 > 8.7 (very powerful medium tank with a 5.0 sec reload and auto cannon, and great gun depression, often it’s so open it will be hit with little to no damage).
Begleitpanzer 57 9.7 > 10.3 (pretty much a IRST lock-less 2s38, being faster and better armored at a whole br lower. This can often reduce all enemy CAS like it didn’t exist, especially helicopters, which makes it surprisingly under br’d still. The TOW is usable for long range hits, or as a back up weapon.)
Wiesel 1A2 9.7 → 10.0 although it’s survivability Is considered low, it is a extremely effective tool with -20 degrees gun depression, and top attack as well as tandem ATGMs, it has good mobility, and is tiny for a vehicle, with good thermals. it’s a mystery why it has stayed so low br.
Leopard 2A5 12.3> 12.0 (this Leo fits better as a 12.0 instead of stacked up at 12.3.)
Russia:
T-34 E STZ 4.0 > 4.3 (no need for two T-34s at the same br, the STZ also has a smaller turret).
KV-1E 4.3 > 4.0 (it’s true only pro being armor, it cannot fight a lot of 4.7 / 5.0 / 5.3 mediums, let alone heavy tanks, the fact is consistently sees panthers, and Vk30s makes it worthless.
It should get a new shell, or go back to 4.0, as 4.3 is too much when better vehicles are about.)
KV-1(Zis-5) 4.7 > 4.3 (the Sweden one is 4.7 with a far better turret and same gun, making little sense why they are identical in BR placement.)
KV-220 6.0 → 5.7 and minor Reload buff.
reload buff: 7.4 secs aced → 7.1 secs. reason: being pretty equal to an IS-1 / other competitors such the Tiger 1 it really doesn’t do well in 6.0 matches which are regularly 6.7 it has the same firepower as a 5.7 Russian medium. it also has two loaders so loading as slow as 7.4 secs for an 85mm makes no sense I did a tally at comment 1985, which concluded 45% of games were 7.0 matches, and 45% were 6.7 matches in which the KV-220 struggles in. 6.3 matches were never found in the 20 gams played and the last 10% were 6.0 matches.
T-44(FM) 6.3 → 6.0 reason: very bad armor / survivability, also a poor gun for 6.3
Its pros are mobility and BR-367 which is understandable for 6.0, but 6.3 is pushing it,
It has far too many weak spots or enemies pen you everywhere.
IS-6 7.7 > 7.3 (terrible reload, bad gun depression, gunner optics are a big weak point aams as roof hatches, bad penetration, not equal to other 7.7s in performance, being typically equal to or slightly better than the IS-3, not enough to warrant a br difference).
T-54 (1947) 7.7 > 7.3 (absolutely terrible vehicle, other than armor, gun handling sucks, shell is okay, turret traverse is like a panther D. The cons make fighting vehicles with HEAT-FS a living hell, as your armor was made to stop AP, APHE, etc).
T-54 (1949) 8.0 > 7.7 (same as above)
T-64A (1971) 9.3 > 9.0 (has worse gun elevation degrees a second vs br 1.0 tanks, has armor that may stop early HEAT-FS, but will not stop APFSDS nearly at all. its pros are: good turret armor, pretty decent gun, and low profile. Cons: slow, slow reload, bad hull armor, easy to 1 hit kill.)
2s25 9.3 > 9.7 (speedy with a good gun, lacking thermals and survivability, spreads out the vehicles).
Krizantema-S 9.7 > 10.0 (ability to use radar to detect tanks, mostly sees 10.3 / 10.7 matches anyways. Has 2 good ATGMs, and gen 3 thermals. Lacks good survivability)
T-72B 10.3 > 10.0 (pretty much a T-72A but at a br where everyone fires APFSDS, absolutely terrible to play when you can’t rely on a single part of your tank like: speed, reload, armor. The only good thing is the gun).
2s38 10.3 > 10.7 (decent jack of all trades, lacks armor though, however it probably shouldn’t see 9.3s)
T-80UD 10.3 → 10.7
Given its recent fix to its autoloader speed giving its true reload, it is reasonably now 10.7 material.
Britain:
Skink 5.3 > 5.0 (same reason as USA
G6 6.7 > 6.3 (locked turret that can only traverse roughly 20 degrees left or right of the center of the tank. It has little armor and is a massive target).
Fox 7.7 > 8.0 (insane mobility and lethality, able to cross an entire map in the span of 15-25 seconds, with a gun that can kill most tanks).
Conquerer 7.7 > 8.0 (excellent armor and stabilized gun with a good round)
ZA35 8.7 > 9.0 (faster gepard meaning quicker easier flanks).
TTD Reload buff given, top reload 6.7 → 6.0 seconds.
Japan:
Heavy tank no.6 6.0 > 5.7 (lacking add on armor, and smoke launchers, which are useless, block gun depression. It also is the only 6.0 tank for its br.).
Type 61 6.7 > 7.0 (great penetration, all around a good tank, but poor armor).
ST-A3 6.7 > 7.0 (6.0 sec auto loader is too good for manually loaded tanks around).
Ho-Ri prototype 6.7 > 7.0 (extremely good armor for a 6.7, decent reload, good speed, and devastating cannon).
Type 60 SPRG 6.7 > 7.0 (rattier M56, easier to hide as well, as being .50 cal proof).
Type 99 7.3 > 7.7 (auto loaded arty with the biggest amount of HE filler in its shell, should’ve never been able to see 6.3s).
Ho-Ri production 7.3 > 7.7 (a better Ho Ri prototype, being able to bounce / take absurd amounts of damage rivaling the maus. Very good mobility, and a very good gun).
All type 90 MBTs 11.7 → 12.0
Being the fastest MBT in the game with an excellent 4.0 sec reload, it’s strange that it has sat 0.3 br lower than its competitors. Its armor profile is odd but it can reasonably bounce M829A1 and thanks to its recent buff on armor around the gun mantlet it’s beefier than usual. It can take early game positions quickly and if a couple skilled players crew it, it can result in an instant loss for the opposing team.
China:
CM-25 8.7 > 8.3 (there is literally no reason why it shouldn’t be the same br as the other M113A1s)
Object 122MT 8.7 > 9.0 (a far better T-62, boasting better armor, with enhanced mobility, and the ability to fire 4 ATGMs rapidly along side its main gun).
AFT09 9.0 > 9.3 (can launch 4 ATGMs in rapid succession and is decently fast).
Italy:
Pzh2000Hu 7.7 > 8.0 (same reason as German one)
Sidam 25 8.3 > 8.0 (absolutely terrible aa, worse than ZSU-23-4, Gepard, M163, etc).
Dardo 10.0 > 9.7 (fast firing auto cannon, but worse protection than the Bradley, very poor atgm storage leading to being hit in empty space and detonating. No IRST lock, very poor survivability, this and the Vcc80/30 are the same br. Moving this to 9.7 gives a decent 9.7 lineup for Italy).
Sidam 25 Mistral 9.7 → 9.3
Being one of the worst spaa in the game, having mistrals is nice, but they are lack luster, combined with your extremely poor survivability, mobility, and cannons only firing 60 APDS, then 400 HE, your often unable to defend yourself.
VRCC/ Centauro I 105 R 9.7 → 9.3
This vehicle has for a long time been a relatively bad vehicle, good in mobility, but not much else. Its survivability is rather poor as it’s a light tank, but its gun handling isn’t much better. Its 6.7 sec load is a bit bad for it as well. Then with the addition of turret baskets, one hit pretty much anywhere to the vehicle typically results in the inability to fire back as usually your transmission is also destroyed.
KF41 11.0 > 10.7 (has an APS but is a worse puma in survivability)
Freccia (fix spike LR consistency vs tanks, and perhaps give it the option of a stock APDS belt)
Aubl 74 / HVG reload buff 6.0 secs > 4.25 secs (only logical If 120mm cannons can reload in 5.0 seconds, it doesn’t make sense how / why a 60mm cannon loads in 6.0 seconds. Lending itself to being one of the worst reloads for one of the worst cannons in the game).
M300 spall damage increased by 16% (this would help out both the Vcc80/60 and justify its 9.3 br change, and also help out the Aubl 74/ HVG)
France:
M4 (FL10) 5.0 > 5.3 (better than most Sherman’s, while having a 10 round magazine and a 5.0 sec load time, make this a nasty tank to encounter).
AMX 50 (TO/90) 8.0 > 7.7 (being slightly faster, with less armor and penetration than the somua, with a APHE round, it never made sense to move this to 8.0 after its battlepass ended, as 8.0 and up it struggles to fight a lot of vehicles if they’re stabilized, well armored, etc.)
Somua SM 7.7 → 8.0 (can go 3v1 easily in downtier, with a skinny gun, and all around being a jack of all trades with good pen.)
Df105 8.0 > 8.3 (same reason as German).
Sweden:
Added by: Profile - karnitin75 - War Thunder — official forum
Spj fm/43-44 1.7 > 2.0
Has great armor for 1.7, making it surprisingly survivable. The 150mm recoilless gun is extremely effective and comes with a decently short reloadfor such a large caliber. Combined with its excellent mobility, this vehicle performs exceptionally well for its BR all the way to 3.3/3.7. Its an Amazing Bonk vehicle with great mobility and is much Immune to Heavy MGs.
Strv m/41 S-I & Strv m/41 S-II 2.7 > 3.0
(Also, replace the stock AP round with APHE or APDS.)
These are excellent support and scouting tanks.
They have APDS rounds that perform exceptionally well for their BR (and even above), decent armor, good mobility, and fantastic gun depression.
The only real reason they seem to sit at 2.7 is because of their sub-par stock AP round, which only offers about 50 mm of penetration.
U-sh 204 gk 5.3 > 5.0
The 20mm cannon is practically useless against anything with more than 10mm of armor (despite its lies of 57mm Pen.) While the vehicle’s speed is great and its armor can handle small-arms fire (and even 12.7mm rounds from certain angles), the gun itself is ineffective against ground targets at its current BR. It also lacks a scouting ability
Pvkv m/43 (1963) 5.0 > 4.7
Arguably a worse Pvkv m/43 (1946), this version adds a thin sheet roof and APDS rounds that can penetrate the front of most tanks, but the armor remains unchanged where it really matters. The front and side protection are identical, offering no real improvement in survivability.
On top of that, mobility has been sliced in half, making it feel much slower and less responsive than the 1946 version.
Overall, this vehicle would be much better suited at 4.7
Bkan 6.7 > 7.0 (fast firing gun, Proxy, decent mobility, and makes the 6.7 lineup even more powerful.)[
U-SH 405 8.0 > 8.3 (a much faster and quieter rakentenautomat).
Pbv 501 6.7 > 7.3 (should never be a BMP-1 below 7.3 regardless of not having an atgm, as the main gun is quite good.)
T-54 8.0 > 7.7 (same reason as Soviet one)
Pbv 302 (Bill) 8.7 > 8.3 (these atgm launcher systems are absolutely terrible to play / spade. It’d be easier to eat one’s own hands).
Itpsv Leopard 8.7 > 9.3 (being a better, and better armored Gepard, it’s strange it’s only been one br higher. 9.3 is a good fit for it though.)
LvKv 9040c 10.3 > 10.0 (long load times after all first stage ammo is fired, also stacking two AAs at the same br doesn’t help.)
Israel
Magach 6M - no BR change, give it M413 (DM33 equivalent)
give it M413 to bring it in line with other 9.0 pattons, since it is currently completely outclassed by its BR contemporaries
Spoiler
as it currently stands, this is the worst 9.0 patton
compared to the american TTS it has:
-much worse turret armor (since this magach has the m60 turret)
-worse ERA (260 CE compared to 400 CE)
-MUCH worse dart, the m111 is a dm23 equivalent, while others have dm33 or m774
-worse optics, 7.2-8x zoom compared to 3-12x
all in all there is isn’t much point in playing this one, its just completely outclassed in so many ways
giving it m413 would atleast close the gap with the chinese/thai TTS
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Pray tell, which Typhoon?
Please read the following.
You may disagree with me because of my astonishingly high K/D in the plane (joke) but this doesn’t actually subtract in any way from my claim the plane is too bad to be 14.3
I’ll level with you and say that if other planes were balanced this way, the game would be good.
1 step for AESA and 1 step for more ARH. Actually sane to balance like that, just ruins the plane when it’s the only one besides the hornets, treated this way.
You have the right to say that, but we cannot make direct comparisons in this discussion. It’s stupid and pointless because all aeroplanes end up being different.
one post per vehicle
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It is not competitive against Su-30SM2s or Rafales, but it is against mechanical Eurofighters which are blind.
You’re saying it like 70 degree gimbal is bad, it’s not, in fact most radars are of that gimbal in toptier. Rafale, mechanical EFT, Super Hornet, F-15C GE.
BVR isn’t actually too relevant in toptier, otherwise Rafale would be suffering but I would not claim that.
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we just need a decompression of the br range
IS6 should not get dropped tho its the best of the IS series of tanks and is straight OP
T54 is literally a way better tiger 2H why would it be anywhere near any 6.7s thats just straight op T26E5 cant even pen it anywhere frontally
and the KV1E shouldnt go any lower literally nothing can pent it a 3.3
5.7s just need to get moved up like they did with tiger 1s
It has a large sample size of players and it’s doing better than average.
It should go up, and its stats support it.