On regard of time, I guess its the point of monkeys with typewriters. If the game runs for 10 more years I am sure every tree will have the vehicle they deserve, Germany gets a MAN truck based pantsir, Russia gets their trialed centauro, US gets a type 69 captured in Iraq. But will they be available at a particular time in a particular meta? Probably no.
I don’t know why when a minor nation player said they need better equipments, there’s always another minor player said they suffer more so they need be improved first, instead of requesting Gaijin fix ALL these nations
I think the point is though, they could add a dozen vehicles to a minor nation and it fix nothing, or they could add 1 or 2 well thought out additions that actually deal with the problem a minor nation is having, combined with actually fixing some very old issues for existing vehicles and much of that suffering goes away.
Like actually adding a top tier SPAA for Israel and Italy or fixing the ready rack for the CR1/2s.
Quite often Gaijin’s solution isnt to fix the problem, but bandaid it with a totally different vehicle. Like slapping a Leopard 2A7 in the Italian tree instead of fixing the Ariete. Seems like they are doing the same “fix” for France.
With the amount of vehicles added each major update, they could address every single minor nations most immediate problems, in 1 single update, if they made the effort. Figuring out those problems would just take some community consultation
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And that’s a reason why i see some Chinese players boycott Singapore vehicles, cause they afraid when they ask Gaijin to fix they own their domestic vehicles, Gaijin will say “You already have F-15SG and Leo 2SG, now get away and shut up”
I agree they could add sub-TT for these nations which have their domestic vehicles but don’t have enough vehicle for a full TT, but the domestic vehicles should be considered first. Also the sub TT should also be special like N. and S. Korea, which have their own Chonma-2 and K2, instead of infinity C&P Leopards, or at least they have their own special upgrades like CM-11 or Strv 122s. BNL TT is really horrible… as their have only few domestic designs
and this is why I fight so hard against sub-TTs for Britain. When I ask for fixes for the Tornado F3 or SHar FA2 people bring up the Gripen.
Im of the opinion that with a few very very niche examples. No nation “needs” a Sub-TT. They all have or had options, but just take effort or some… creative license (like adding tested vehicles/prototypes)
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100%.
Subtree’s should be the last resort. The icing on the cake. A way to keep updating tree’s, and bolstering lineups after domestic options have been depleted.
They keep telling us the line ‘nothing comes in place for something else’, but so often it doesn’t feel like that when you go on to wait years (or forever and counting) for the domestic option.
So often I feel this sentiment gets misconstrued for ungratefulness, when it’s not that, it’s more just the opportunity cost that weighs on the mind.
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Yep, agreed.
The innaccuracies have gotten so bad that some Chinese players have just accepted that the issues will never be fixed, and that they really don’t care about whether other nation’s vehicles will be added or not to Chinese TT.
The idea that late 2000s ZTZ99A is comparable to 1980s T-72B in hull armor protection is quite funny. 99A has a completely different chassis compared to even original ZTZ99. So I guess 55 tons vs 44 tons, 11 tons is wasted on air?
And for next update, they will be giving Chinese PLZ-05 spall liners, but have said nothing about Chinese tanks even though they can be clearly seen in many images. But Gaijin doesn’t take photos as evidence.
And I don’t need to go on about 577mm of pen with 7.1 second reload. If you’re going to keep 7.1 second of reload, then change DTC-10 so that it is at very least better than 3BM60 (which it is irl) or give the max 6.7 second reload speed which is revealed by the Thai VT-4 manual for Chinese autoloader.
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Never understood the way they handle reloads.
Like, with Autoloaders, they seem hard set on maintaining ‘realism’ for RU/CN, but then they will nerf the likes of Leclerc / Type-10’s reload from what’s realistic for balance.
Then with manual reloads, they’re very quick to adjust Abrams / Leo’s reloads if they’re performing too good or bad. But then there’s a significant lag for the others
I think of Abrams going down to 5s, yet they left Merkava, who is worse in every way at 6.7s. Then over the span of months it went down to 6s. Then finally down to 5s. Like why not just do this to begin with? Why put stats over objective ability ?
I feel really sorry for Chally. 5s was his only gimmick, and now so many others do it too (with much larger first stages).
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Afaik the Leclerc has its historical reload, but the Type-10 can get down to about 3 seconds, and reload changes could push the tank to a BR to where it is no longer that good. Iirc the Strv 103s can have a sub 3 second reload, but I don’t want that, since I don’t want an 8.3/8.7 strv-103.
There’s also the issue of some first stage ready racks taking forever to reload, such as the challengers. The French autoloaded Mediums have a similar issue, it takes so long for one to be reloaded.
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I’ve seen people suggest Chally should have a bigger first stage (no idea if accurate or not), but even if they don’t opt for that, they should definitely buff the replenishment time. It’s ridiculously long right now.
I have often felt like the smaller nations have to unduly suffer for unreasonable lengths of time, to make a big enough dent in the stats for the snail to give them some tlc. (Be that in the form of buffs or BR change).
As someone with severe skill issues, I am doing my part to lower the stats of such vehicles, but seems like the average person using them is doing too good lol.
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Yeah, just find some prototypes could make the line much bigger just like how Sub-TT does now, and we could already see LCT and TKXs in the game. In fact, i even thought the chance of adding paper vehicles into game, cause these small nations might can’t make real functional prototypes (lack of technology or just economical reason) while USA or USSR have so many testing vehicles that never be chosen.
Some nation may needs a Father TT(?) or combined TT if their vehicle is still too less for a single TT or like Israel, lack of WW2 vehicles, but yes, every nation could have a full TT by only domestic vehicles.
Balance. I heard someone offical said reloading time is a way to balance, though i never seen the source.
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https://community.gaijin.net/issues/p/warthunder/i/ojFgCJ6Jnos4
https://community.gaijin.net/issues/p/warthunder/i/nzUoCC2yxJx5
Should be about 20 rounds (min 16 max about 26). The best guess. We got a tiny ready rack when we had the fastest reload as a balancing thing, but they never undid it when everyone else got a 5 second reload.
CR1s are actually the same
https://community.gaijin.net/issues/p/warthunder/i/m22cZZxaNPXJ
Yeah… Smallest ready rack in game (I think) and also a really long reload.
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And even worse many of those who choose smaller nations are skillful players, so they could make the stat much higher than average player does
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See: Char25T, the EBRs, and many aircraft.
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This is one of those rare instances where the snail opted not to do ‘copy paste’, when they really should have.
There really is quite a lot of stuff that could go in Israeli rank I-III, and a lot of it would just require a simple reskin, or partial use of existing models (I.e new turret on old hull)
No doubt some would complain about a lot of UK/US/FR/RU things being there, but as far I’m concerned, if you want to play Israel, you’ve got to grind the early ranks of one of those countries anyway, so what difference does it really make lol.
I’d much prefer that as opposed to this current setup, where people have to jump right in at 6.0 with no crew skills.
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IMO a big issue is player quality causing overtiered vehicles. Not many new players are drawn to minor nations, so they’re often stuck with stuff like the Re 2005 a full BR above where it belongs.
The balance of top-level ground combat has always been very poor, and now it has reached an unbearable level. We spent the same amount of money grinding TT but only got an extremely bad experience.
There are two options now.
1.BUFF China, Italy, Israel, UK, France top MBT.
2. delete all other factions. Only the Soviet and Sweden remain in this game.
For the first option, I propose the following.
China:
fiexd the turret armor of ZTZ99A. hull KE increased to 800 (acknowledged suggestion)
fiexd the armor thickness of Khalid/MBT2000/VT4 hull (acknowledged suggestion)
Increase the loading speed of VT4/99A to 6.66s.
Increase the penetration power of DTC-10 to 635mm（gaijin refused to accept on the grounds of confidentiality）
Britain：
Challenger 2 and Challenger 3 loading speed reduced to 5 s.
France：
Supplement Leclerc’s upper hull armor ≈ 400+KE
The loading speed reduced to 4s.
Israel：
Mekava 4M hull KE increased to 600
Italy：
Improve the defense of the Ariete WAR kit.
Additional:
Partial vehicles lowered their matching level from 12.0 to 11.7 or 11.3
Here are some other noted issues:
Challenger 2 add-on armor packages also provide not enough armor. The composite armor/era kit for 2F and TES barely provides any protection.
Leclerc is missing spall liner.
Ariete should just go down in BR. Ariete also has composite armor and not spaced armor in hull.
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The Abrams should’ve never gotten 5 second reload imo. I hate how Gaijin uses reload speed as a way to balance tanks, especially when tanks with autoloaders exist and are always implemented with fixed reload time.
Before, tanks like Leclerc had an advantage with 5 second reload. Now, Abrams has same 5 second reload. Who will now play Leclerc over Abrams now? The Abrams is better than the Leclerc in pretty much every way. The only reason you will play Leclerc is because you like the tank itself, and not the performance ingame.
The Challenger 2 suffers even more. One of the only advantages of the Challenger 2 was the 5 second reload. The Challengers are heavy and slow, yet they do not have the armor to back it up and have massive weakspots. They also fire the worst shell at top tier. And yet Gaijin still refuses to fix their armor profile and improve the effectiveness of add-on armor.
2 Likes