I’d normally agree, however, this is not a Russian vehicle and it is a unique variant that wasn’t even used by Ukraine, the country that provided it to the US - making it suitable only for the US tree, in my opinion.
2 Likes
I am really unsure that the US needs T-84 from Ukraine.
But Ehhh… if Gaijin really needs to add this thing in this game
Anywhere but not Russia, please.
In this case, US might be the place for it as long as US bought that.
Adding Ukraine TT and giving this to them, just like the Desert Warrior case, will be best
(Dessert Warrior is built by UK for Kuwait, not for the British army, I heard. So adding Ukraine-built T-80, which is owned by the US, into Ukraine TT will not be a big problem.)
But IMO, it seems introducing Ukraine TT has an even lower chance than ‘US gets T-84’
1 Like
I’m sorry, but where was the thing built? What vehicle was it designed to mock? Does it use US ammo? US Protection systems? What about a US engine? A US Gun? US MGs? A US Autoloader? US tracks? etc. etc.
I get it was modified for the US, but it was modified to be a Soviet T-80UD. Not a separate vehicle. Not a domestic design. it was modified to be a Soviet Tank we already had in game. So while yes; it is not OWNED by Russia, it is Russian in design, doctrine, and ideas. Everything other than where the vehicle is and who bought it is Russian. So, therefore, it is Russian. Not American, and certiantly not genuinely unique. In ANY regard.
3 Likes
Maybe for an Ukranian TT but not for the US, no need to add soviet stuff there and vice versa
2 Likes
Let me clarify, I’m fine with the opinion you think this shouldn’t go to the US tree, everyone has there opinion however, this is NOT RUSSIAN. Neither is it Russian design, doctrine, and ideas, its designed off of Soviet construction. There is a difference. It’s a Ukrainian built vehicle (while Ukraine was part of the Soviet Union when the T-80UD was originally built, it was built at the factory in Kharkiv in Ukraine) and post-fall of the USSR, it was further manufactured and refined by Ukraine. This specific variant was fully designed for export/US with many of the Ukrainian battlefield management/electronics removed but still retains a lot of the T-84’s components that would be important for gameplay i.e. French Catherine 2nd-generation thermal imager, Ukrainian indigenous Nozh ERA (which no Russian vehicle has), Ukrainian diesel engine, etc.
I get “perception is reality” but this thing does have quite a difference from many Soviet/Russian designed vehicles.
3 Likes
Is the PT-91 a Russian tank? Is the every eastern design Russian? By that logic there is not a single unique vehicle in the Chinese TT, which is obviously false.
Additionally, the T-80UD was designed and produced in Ukraine SSR, and many other vehicles were designed and produced outside Russian SSR. The USSR was an empire, not a single nation state. I won’t get political, but this is not copy paste.
Additionally you might not know all that much about the US military industrial complex, because not everything made in the US. The US military actively has Russian vehicles in service with SOCOM and with NATO OPFOR wargames. The US uses some Polish Piorun manpads, a deep upgrade of igła. We live on a global economy, the world isnt completely isolated from each other.
This is probably of the most unique of the T-series which is sad to see that you don’t recognize. If you wanted US TT to be only for us vehicles, it is wayyy to late for that.
5 Likes
It is absolutely not Russian, you could say the same for Chinese tanks since they use so many similar design choices…the 478BEM is in reality closer to ZTZ99A’s design choices (better reverse) making it far different than any Russian tank and an insult to call it such.
3 Likes
Updated the ammunition section as well to reflect what is believed to be sent to the US.
Just for everyone’s awareness, this post was originally made for the Ukraine/Other Nations section but moderators moved it to the US section due to the US being the sole user/recipient of this vehicle.
1 Like
Any idea the reload speed of it lr is it just the t80 reload
T-80 reload speeds unfortunately
I am confused? Why would the USSR (since the T-80’s are theirs) let Americans buy these? Like I am totally confused. But IG it’s nice to meet something other than the Abrams and Click-baits, so yeah, for varieties sake it’s probably good.
It’s not USSR, it’s post-USSR Ukraine. Ukraine developed this variant. This deal happened in the early 2000’s. Ukraine built the T-80UD at Kharkiv while it was the Ukraine SSR and when it became independent, continued to develop its own tanks with further evolutions of the T-80UD, ERA, munitions, and eventually the T-84/BM Oplot. This vehicle is a Ukrainian Oplot that has been semi-stripped of sensitive technologies and sold to the U.S. for export. This variant is only used by the U.S. for testing and analysis.
1 Like
OHH, so Ukraine escaped Russia and leaked Russian docs to the US for help?
No, Ukraine was a major manufacturer of technology while it was part of the Soviet Union. Ukraine produced a LOT of weapons for the USSR which includes T-64’s, T-80UD’s, R-77’s (for a while, the sole producer of it in the USSR), and more. Ukraine and Russia both have there large defense industries originate from the Soviet Union. They’re not the same, they both have independent developments and Ukraine sold what it deemed as its own technology to sell. Ukraine sold it the US as a way likely to branch out Westward. This was prior to any major conflicts.
3 Likes
OKOK thank you!!!
1 Like
No worries, feel free to check out my Ukraine Ground Forces Tree if you want to see what kind of technological developments Ukraine has made:
1 Like
Ye, I used to chat there.
1 Like
TAPNA can be used withoud modifications to the autoloader
In Ukraine, V.A. Malyshev Kharkov Transport Machine Building Plant
It was not designed to mock anything
Technically can use M-60 tracks
Can use after a little modification to the MG mount (it was done on T-72AMT zr.2022)
While it is just plain “whataboutism” about the key components of the tank, which require a giant reconstruction, i am tempted to respond.
US doesn’t have a suitable engine, doesn’t have serially produced autoloader which could be installed there, gun could be installed into T-84-120 turret, but it was not ordered, therefore your question is invalid
Nuh-uh. It is much closer in appearance to the Pakistani T-80UD (not the one represented in game, but the modified)
Show me one SOVIET T-80UD with Drozd and welded turret
Technically false since all 3 produced tanks are at Aberdeen training facility in Maryland state, USA
3 Likes
Oh, they’re still floating about? Hmm hope the Armor and Cav Collection can get one for display
3 Likes
Yup, they’re still there, used for testing as needed.
1 Like