I didnt answer your question because its stupid, you can use your armour reliably against a BMP in any toptier MBT it only takes one hit to kill a BMP
3 Likes
Logical fallacy my beloved
I can’t wholeheartedly say the M1 Abrams has better armour than the 2A4 when it’s an MBT than can reliably die to 30mm APFSDS from the front. What type of MBT is that? Light Tank MBT? 😂
The turret ring is the only spot on the entire front of the vehicle which is worse than the leopard, every other part the M1 is better in. We have not been talking about 30mm APFSDS in this thread, the focus has been around the M1 and MBTs of other nations at the BR. Even after the turret ring thickness is changed it will still be vulnerable to the calibre the discussions have been focused around.
2 Likes
Why is it stupid?
Have you never faced a scenario where you had to push an auto cannon light tank, or being pushed by one?
The problem with the Leclercs, Type 10, and of course the Abrams, is that they have little to no protection against any threat that have more than 80mm of penetration (whether it be a dart of APDS).
The same cannot apply nearly as well as with other MBTs.
Well, we have been talking about armour, and completing dismissing the fact that its armour is surprisingly susceptible to even the smallest APFSDS is crazy, considering this is supposed to be an MBT.
Well, we have been talking about armour, and completing dismissing the fact that its armour is surprisingly susceptible to even the smallest APFSDS is crazy, considering this is suppose to be an MBT.
Yes we have been talking about armour in relation to other MBTs and the protection that armour provides against shells of other nations MBTs.
1 Like
I have been pushed by light tanks most recently the hordes of 2s38 since the sales started and ive not had a single one kill my 2s38 abuse lineup from the front being the M1 and LAV-AD because its a light tank you can one shot it anywhere while the 2s38 has to aim
1 Like
In which case, I still believe the armour is inferior, just because of what I stated previously:
If we talk about the armour in a more general case, the M1 Abrams’ armour is much more inferior.
1 Like
Its not its objectively more armoured than the leopard 2a4
Sure, whoever shoots first wins.
Do I have to mention the BMP-2M has a firerate of 550 RPM?
The 2S38 has a firerate of 120 RPM, for reference.
Pretty sure even frontally those 2 can withstand a BMP-2M. At least in my Type 90’s I’ve survived engagements with them.
Those damn 2S38s on the other hand, though…
Again, 30mm APFSDS (or any dart / apds with more than ~80mm of pen) can reliably pen the armour of the Abrams much more easily than any other 10.7 MBT.
Do i have to mention the 2s38 has far more pen and a more accurate gun
If we talk about the armour in a more general case, the M1 Abrams’ armour is much more inferior.
It most definitely is not “much inferior”. The same autocannon BMPs you’re complaining about have absolutely zero armour in comparison to the M1. Additionally if using the abrams hull-down where it would excel the turret ring can be entirely negated as it is below the barrel. I would much rather have more functional armour against MBTs than a small weakspot against BMPs.
If you don’t want to aim, the BMP-2M is the better option, in this case.
I’m comparing the effectiveness of the armour between the Abrams’ and the Leo 2A4’s. Where did I mention the effectiveness of the BMP-2M’s?
LFP of Leclerc is surprisingly weak. The turret ring of Type 90 / Type 10 is quite large compared to other MBTs, although not as large as the Abrams’.
BMP-2M fires 30mm APFSDS. It was an example of a vehicle that uses it.
Also this entire line of argumentation is irrelevant given that the turret ring has been acknowledged and is going to be changed.
2 Likes
What, this?
This seems more like a nerf than anything - unless you are talking about something else.
The Ariete, chally mk.2, chally mk.3 and chally2, black night, chally3, Chally2 E can all be killed by 30mm easier as the entire LFP can be penned