- Yes.
- No.
- In a future Dutch/BeNeLux techtree.
- In the French BeNeLux sub-tree.
- Other (Please explain in the comments).
- I said “No” in the first question.
- As laid down (2 x 230mm) ← Muzzleloading guns, as a joke ofcourse
- 1884’s refit (1 x 280mm, 4 x 37mm)
- I said “No” in the first question.
Today I’m going to suggest a real old ship of the Dutch Navy.
This is the “Monitor 2de klasse” HNLMS Krokodil (1868)!
HNLMS Krokodil in her original refit with the breachloading guns. This photo might have been taken in England where HNLMS Krokodil was built
Source: Foto's
About the “Monitor 2de klasse” classification
As the name suggests, what this simply means is turret Monitor 2nd-class. And there is something interesting about this. Back in the day when ships like these were being built, the Dutch Navy didn’t quite use “proper” class names for their ships.
Nowadays we all know ships by their class names, Yamato-class battleship, Admiral Hipper-class cruiser, etc etc.
What the Dutch Navy had back in the day was a more simple system using 1st and 2nd-class names to group certain ships together. HNLMS Krokodil (1868) was not the only monitor 2nd-class, there were four more. These five ships were build in different shipyards, and so the ships all different in design. But all five of the ships had a primary gun turret, and all ships fulfilled the same role they were designed for. Therefor the four ships were put under the same classification of “Monitor 2de klasse”.But there is one more thing to note. The ship in this suggestion is a Monitor 2nd-class. That is important because there are also Ram Monitor 2nd-class ships. And these look extremely similar, but are considered a different class of ship.
Source: https://www.maritiemdigitaal.nl/
Source: https://www.maritiemdigitaal.nl/
Two very nice illustrations showing the different hull and bow designs of different (ram)monitors of the Dutch Navy. On the first photo the ship at the top is a Monitor 2nd-class, and the other two are Ram Monitor 2nd-class ships. On the bottom photo, the top down view at the top, and the views at the bottom right, are of Ram Monitor 2nd-class ships. The cross sections at the bottom left are of Monitor 2nd-class shipsIf we wanted to be super specific about the classification of the HNLMS Krokodil (1868), and it’s “sister ships”, then this is how we would do it:
- Monitor 2nd-class
- Cerberus-type
- HNLMS Cerberus (1869)
- HNLMS Bloedhond (1869)
- Heiligerlee-type
- HNLMS Heiligerlee (1868)
- HNLMS Krokodil (1868)
- Tijger-type
- HNLMS Tijger (1868)
History
Spoiler
A nice drawing of HNLMS Krokodil in her original refit
Source: Foto'sHNLMS Krokodil was laid down in 1867, and would be launched in 1868. The Dutch Navy didn’t have much experience with the construction of these new turret equipped ship designs, so she would be made abroad, at Gebr. Laird, Birkenhead, England.
HNLMS Krokodil would stay in the homewaters of the Netherlands for all of her carreer. And sadly there isn’t really anything to mention here. The only things mentioned is that in August of 1871 she was part of a small fleet that went for a visit to Antwerpen. When this small fleet left again they took the remains of Dutch soldiers that died there during the " Siege of Antwerp" of 1832.
The only other thing that shows up is that HNLMS Krokodil was part of a fleet again in the “Hollands Diep” on the 15th of September 1898.
HNLMS Krokodil would remain in service till 1900. By 1907 the ship was sold for scrap.
HNLMS Krokodil in her 1884 refit
Source: Foto's
Design
Spoiler
A blueprint of the 1884 refit where the 28 cm A No. 1 breachloading gun was added to the turret
Source: | Nationaal ArchiefHNLMS Krokodil was 56,60 metres long, had a beam of 13,33 metres and a draft of 3,01 meters, and had a displacement of 1.530 tons. She had a crew of 113 men (This was later expanded to 134) and was able to reach a top speed of 9 knots.
[u]She was originally armed with a two 23 cm RML 9-inch Armstrong guns in one central turret.
These guns had acces to various AP and Schrapnel rounds. But ofcourse these are muzzle loading guns, and those don’t really fit ingame at all.Thankfully the ship went through a refit in 1884 that saw the removal of these muzzle loading guns and had them replaced with a single 28 cm A No. 1 breachloading gun.
This gun was capable of firing Common, AP and Canister rounds.During this 1884 refit four 37mm Hotchkiss guns were added too. Two five barrel revolving guns were added to each side of the rear superstructure. And two single barrel guns were added to the ends of the ship. One was at the front in a crows nest, and the other at the very rear.
HNLMS Krokodil was protected by a 114 - 140 mm thick belt. The deck was 19 - 25 mm thick, and the command tower was 140 mm.
The gun turret was 203 - 280 mm thick.
Another blueprint of HNLMS Krokodil of her 1884 refit
Source: | Nationaal Archief
Ingame
Spoiler
The HNLMS Krokodil would be a real weird ship to add ingame. The current Naval gamemode is not really made for these very old ships. This ship would be best added in some sort of Pre-WW1 Naval gamemode for it to be really fun to play ingame. HNLMS Krokodil is very closely related to 1860’s to 1900’s monitors. Luckily HNLMS Krokodil does have a breachloading gun that is still capable of dishing out some damage against lower rank Naval Vessels. If Krokodil had to be added somewhere ingame right now, I would say put her in the Coastal Fleet. I think a ship like her is best added there.
Now where should these boats go to? As usualy with my Dutch vehicle suggestions, I ofcourse want to see this ingame in a Dutch or BeNeLux techtree. Ofcourse the BeNeLux has been added to France, so this is now the only option where Dutch vessels will go to.
I’m not very well versed with early French Naval stuff, so I don’t know if France has many ships like HNLMS Krokodil . But in the French tree the HNLMS Krokodil would most likely fit right in with other older French vessels.
Specifications
Spoiler
Displacement: 1.530 tons
Length: 56,60 m
Beam: 13,33 m
Draft: 3,01 m
Powerplant: 2 x steam engines, 2 x boilers
Power output: 630 hp
Maximum speed: 9 knots (16,69 km/h)
Crew: 113 men (This was increased to 134, but unclear during what time this was)Armor: (Iron)
Belt: 114 - 140 mm
Deck: 19 - 25 mm
Command tower: 140mm
Turret: 203 - 280 mmArmament: (As laid down)
1 x 2 23 cm RML 9-inch Armstrong muzzleloading guns1884 refit:
1 x 1 28 cm A No. 1 breachloading gun
2 x 5 37 mm Hotchkiss revolving guns
2 x 1 37 mm Hotchkiss gunsAmmunition:
23 cm RML 9-inch Armstrong muzzleloading gun
- [AP] Iron Projectile
–Length: 68 cm
–Weight: 105 kg- [AP] Hardened Projectile
–Length: 52 cm
–Weight: 112 kg- [AP] Steel Projectile
–Length: 51 cm
–Weight: 109 kg- [AP] Pointed Bullet (“Puntkogel”)
–Length: 46 cm
–Weight: 113 kg- [Schrapnel] Three types were used, all of the same weight
–Length: Unknown
–Weight: 68.5 kg28 cm A No. 1 breachloading gun
- [Common] Gewone granaat v/ 28cm A L2,8
–Projectile: 206,7 kg round with a 9,3 kg filling, for a total weight of 216 kg
–Charge: 60 kg prismatic gunpowder No. 2
–Velocity: 510 mps- [AP] Glasharde Puntgranaat v/ 28cm A L2,8
–Projectile: 251 kg round with a 2,7 kg filling, for a total weight of 253,7 kg
–Charge: 58,5 kg prismatic gunpowder No. 2
–Velocity: 475 mps (453,5 mps when fired with 50 kg prismatic gunpowder No. 1)
–Penetration: 454 mm of iron at 0 meters- [AP] Stalen Puntgranaat v/ 28cm A L2,8 (1ste model)
–Projectile: 247,25 kg round with a 4,95 kg filling, for a total weight of 252,2 kg
–Charge: 58,5 kg prismatic gunpowder No. 2
–Velocity: 475 mps (453,5 mps when fired with 50 kg prismatic gunpowder No. 1)
–Penetration: 454 mm of iron at 0 meters- [AP] Stalen Puntgranaat v/ 28cm A L2,8 (2de & 3de model)
–Projectile: 250 kg round with a 3,7 kg filling, for a total weight of 253,7 kg
–Charge: 58,5 kg prismatic gunpowder No. 2
–Velocity: 475 mps (453,5 mps when fired with 50 kg prismatic gunpowder No. 1)
–Penetration: 454 mm of iron at 0 meters- [Canister] Kartetsgranaat v/ 28cm A
–Projectile: 124 kg round filled with 251 zinc balls of 0,368 kg each.
–Charge: Unknown
–Velocity: Unknown
HNLMS Krokodil in her 1884 refit. Note the 37mm Hotchkiss guns on the rear and in the front crows nest
Source: Foto's
And there you have it! I hope you enjoyed reading about interesting ship of the Dutch Navy.
See you on the battlefield!
Sources
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History and information:
Extra sources:
Photos:
Blueprints: