They would stay at 12.7 in my opinion. The F-16As with only 9Ls are also 12.7, and I can’t imagine Gaijin would put a Mig-29 with just R-73s at a lower BR.
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The F16A also has one of the best flight models out there - a really good radar - and a decent fuel load.
The 29A on the other hand has probably one of the worst flight performances across the 4th gens (in warthunder)
but well, the F16As flight model is just heavily bloated anyways, so maybe the fulcrum is accurate
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There are also many other factors in this - the F16A is a pretty high BR in my opinion too
Its FM could be nerfed with a FCS to justify a lowering in BR - but that thing is still one of the top dogs when it comes to dueling which is actually comical to think about.
Another example could be the F14A with the Fakours instead - that thing is 12.3 - gets an INSANE radar with INSANE missiles, Really good flight performance, shitton of fuel for BVR larping at 10km and so on
Meanwhile a MiG-29 with R73 would get worse FP, worse radar and so on in return for 4x R73 (or 6x if you wanna go full IR) and sits at a higher BR ?
Seems a bit unfair to me - even with the ERs I dont see a justification for the Fakours being 12.3
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In Ukraine the ability of the 29 to operate without airfields that are massive target for attacks was actually quite valuable.
27 also has intake protection (not doors but grids, like the 29M adopted) but still it’s a much more complex fighter to operate. Fulcrum is also extremely cheap, they made over 1000s of this in just 8 years from 1982 to 1990, it may have been the most produced (and certainly the second most produced after the F-16 despite entering full production 5 years later) 4th gen when ussr fell.
And it should be 13.0, because any lower will make it undertiered.
It’s 12.7 in RB. It also drinks as much fuel as the Mig-29, but it just carries alot more. It’s radar also isn’t as good.
A Mig-29 with 6 R-73s would be at minimum 12.7 in air RB, potentially 13.0. It would be hilariously OP at 12.3 (same BR as a Mig-21Bison, and only a full BR higher than an F-4E or where the Mig-21bis should be).
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I have a Question regarding the Mig29 9-12 and 9-13.
Would they theoreticaly be able to mount and fire the r27er/et as they use the same seeker as the r27r/t.
Or is there anything iam not aware of, which makes it not possible without any modifications to the 9-12 / 9-13?
Should be fine, although some say they were only available for the S variants.
Regardless, i believe they shouldn’t keep the ER because it’s too powerful against 3rd gen, it’s just not fair. 4 r-73 + 2 27Rs would be much more balanced than 4 r-60ms + 2 ERs, or just remove the ER and give It like 12.3 Br… Top tier is just incredibly broken right now like wtf is su-27 doing at 13.0 with 6 ERs, efts and rafales also shouldn’t face mig29Gs or early f15s and 16s…
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Without the ER i’d say 12.7 is completely Fine, it would be a better bison which is a Pretty decent aircraft but it’s not that Op… ER at 12.7 is basically 2 guaranteed kills, archers are good but to turn their shots into guaranteed kills you need Very specific variables like being on the rear of the enemy at less than 2.5km or while dogfighting.
MiG-29 is doing 20 STR at 1 km with DI 42, it’s a reasonable assumption to say 21 STR at 0 km with DI 42.
F-16C has 21.6 DPS with 25% fuel (similar to 1500 kg Fulcrum) but clean.
So, by the numbers, and in this axis, it can have a powerful STR display.
Are you saying that the MiG-29 can do 20 STR at 1 km IRL or in WT?
As far as i know the T’s have the same pylon wiring requirements regardless of variant, so should be no lack of capability to shoot T or ET from any platform that can shoot the T. So short answer yeah they should have no issue.
For the sake of interesting thought tho - only thing i could think of which might be an actual capability concern is potential that maybe modern ET’s could utilise some datalink capability like ER’s do to reach very long ranges outside the seekers capability to initially pick up the target - however that’s pure speculation. But as far as i’ve seen so far on this particular speculation, i read ages ago someone said the module which is supposedly the datalink for R’s is not part of the modular head of the missile but on the main body, and its not present at least on at least earlier production images of T’s & ET’s. But who knows from what i’ve read the main body between r27E’s should be the same with only the head changing between radar/IR variants so maybe they do or maybe they dont. If they do then that could be a compatibility issue as such datalink guidance capability could be held in question on mig29A’s given the conversations previously here regarding their capacity to fire the ER’s - however on that issue idk, from what i understand even the base r27R uses the same datalink system as the ER’s do and the 29A’s can fire that missile just fine sooooo could be no issue at all regardless lol.
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@BBCRF @Giovanex05 - did we come to conclusion on this math battle about 6.4, reading through all that again still didnt seem like it was resolved, granted a decent amount of it was slightly over my head as I’m not yet well versed in aerodynamic calculation. From what i understand you say 6.4 is indeed correct at 13000 mass? Gio says cant be, which seems reasonable given 6.14, but apparently it could be difference in calculation methods between the charts or something?
MiG-21bis at 12.0 is the hottest take I have ever heard
that things BVR capabilites are hot dogshit and the R60M is only usefull in headons or with unaware targets - its the most easy to flare missile ingame
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The F14 having a worse radar than the Mig29?
What makes you think that?
Bc last time I checked the Mig29a / Su27 radar is the worst in high / top tier.
Assuming you aren’t speaking about the Mig29smt, I have to think you never played any Mig29.
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The F14a is still at 12.3 and the F14b at 12.7 in simulator.
I think he is talking about the sim br
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The radar on the mig29/su27 is usually considered superior to the early f16/f15 radar in game because it gets tws and the notch gates are smaller, plus its all aspect pd even though it has less range.
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Mig29g would be fine at 12.7 and they should just give the older migs r73 and folder the 29g. It really has no business at 13.0 anymore with the su33 and su27 being 13.0. It’s just inferior.
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It’s really only target detection where it really suffers. When engaging a single target, the su27 mig 29 radar is perfectly fine
I’d say 13.0 for the G is fine but they should raise the br of the New bvr monsters to at least 14.3, the G and other 13.0 fighters don’t stand a chance against an eurofighter or a rafale unless they are being piloted by someone with negative iq, su-27 deserves 13.3 imo
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I just don’t think it should be the same br as clearly superior machines like the su33 and su27. If they go up that’s another option.
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