It’s disappointing when there’s less than 3 people doing radars and its so slow before you can start sending bombers to high altitude
A lot of people have no idea of what they’re doing and haven’t learned how to locate and dispatch of SAM sites. It’s not like it’s a simple task.
That being said, when you do get a team of people who actively engage in DEAD, it’s absolutely brutal for the enemy team. Not that it shouldn’t be though. It’s a hard task to achieve and the benefit of flying around high altitudes without any danger from AI is sufficient (not to mention that killing the radars gives pretty decent SL).
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The MiG-25PD faced the F-14 in the real world. Their service years are the same (early 1970’s) it makes no sense why Gaijin put it so low of a BR.
Some insights since the event is going to close tomorrow. I really appreciate the devs putting together this Vietnam-era test.
However, the one thing that’s been really frustrating for me in the 8.7-9.7 bracket is the AI capabilities for the Shilka (ZSU-23-4) and M163 Vulcan SPAAs. They have a 100% chance to intercept guided munitions (like the AGM-62A Walleye I’m trying to use in my Premium Israel A-4E). Did one test run, and I’ve had two Walleyes and a single GBU-8 dropped above 4,000 feet on a M163. Both Walleyes and the GBU-8 got deleted in a single pass by the M163, which feels completely unrealistic.
Historically, these vehicles were just classic gun-based SPAA systems with no radar or guidance capability to track missiles or bombs. They were never designed to snipe guided weapons like that. In the higher brackets the SPAA does have modern tracking, and players can actually avoid it with stealthier GNSS-guided ordnance or standoff drops. That makes sense and is fair. But here in the lower BR. This is the place to help anyone new to learn the basics of SAM danger and the introduction of gun SPAA systems. Instead, the Shilka and M163 are intercepting the very first guided weapons we’re given (and most planes in this bracket have no ballistic computer anyway).
This completely breaks the intended flow: the low bracket should be the friendly introduction to the mode, with the difficulty ramping up properly in the higher ranks. Right now it’s making the whole experience alienating for a large part of the playerbase that doesn’t have specific planes (and loadouts) to “work around” it. Many people are just giving up on bombing runs and switching to pure dogfight, which isn’t the fun mode they signed up for. The mode should be fun at least for everyone to take part and help contribute to their team. Not be forced to play certain meta aircraft in order to play, and if they don’t have them available. They are literally left out!
I hope the devs can look at this and reconsider the intercept chance for these gun based SPAA.
4 Likes
Because BRs are not years in service…
bug. thanks. A4N
There are supersonic fighters with all aspects though. Mig21 gets r60m, mig23 gets r60m and r23t, mig25 gets r60m and r40td, and the viggen gets aim9l.
You hit the nail on the head when you mentioned that this should be a game mode for everyone. I’ve been playing at least one match every day since the event started with my Japanese Lineup (T-2 mostly stock with Aim-9E’s, Alpha Jet A mostly upgraded but with only the 500lb bombs, and T-2 Early). Like in air RB the stock T-2 was not fun and that’s kind of to be expected, but the bigger issue was the Alpha Jet. I only just unlocked the rockets on the Alpha jet and was able to play only one match with it since then. Before that I was stuck just using the 500lbs bombs. Between the Alpha Jets slow speed, and the miniscule impact radius of the 500lbs bombs after the bomb nerf taking out AA was nearly impossible. I had to get lucky with a long range (5km) bomb toss landing exactly on target and not getting intercepted by an AA in order to kill one AA. Hitting anything moving was obviously out of the question. I tried gun runs but I died. If I tried to get close with the bomb, I died. Pretty anything I attempted up until I got the rockets and could spray rocket volleys from 5km with the ccip resulted in my death. This of course was very punishing since I don’t currently have premium and every death cost me around 10ksl. The whole experience was aggravating and left a bad taste in my mouth. When I got salty and complained, I was told it was a skill issue, or that it was my fault for not using rockets, or my fault for flying a sub sonic and why? It wasn’t a skill issue cause everything did a 180 once I got rockets, so it was clearly just a, I didn’t have the right weapons or plane to, what, participate in the game mode. In a game mode advertised as open to all (not a vehicle specific event) why am I punished with an inability to interact with the game in any way other than die just because I don’t have a specific module unlocked.
All the current design of AA does, especially for this low BR version, is make players who don’t have a perfect line up feel frustrated and cheated and that’s not a good thing. I understand if some points, like around the long range SAM sites or Depots, have super good AA that requires specific weapons or a tactics to kill that doesn’t seem unreasonable to me. But at the very least the convoys should not be protected by the current cracked gun AA, if at the very least so that players in stock vehicles or partially upgraded vehicles have something they can do so they don’t feel completely irrelevant and leave having had a bad time to never come back. And it’s not like they don’t have worse AA they could add because I know they added worse AA vehicles to the mode. They currently help defend the Ammo Depots alongside the really cracked AA.
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Gaijin needs to nerf the SPAA to really allow for that. I’m also not against removing nukes as a whole as I bet the fantastical SPAA is purely due to it being too easy to farm rewards once you get nukes if it wasn’t OP.
Either way spawn costs are still too high, and the gamemode should be a death cost based system like other gamemodes. Even getting 7k sl per A2A kill barely covers 70% of my spawn cost.
Also do you really think I wouldn’t want to take advantage of what’s essentially a near permanent downtier in the F-106? (Another reason why rolling BR brackets like sim would be better)
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Oh no, I forgot I wanted to play lower bracket on supersabre and starfighters. Gaijin please for the love of Snail, extend this even by 2 more days, I beg you.
Stona, Smin, anybody, please inform devs that players need couple more days of escalation mode.
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Have you considered that the MiG-25 is a flying boat?
And there’s also the two Thai harriers that they only got in the 90s
Ill be honest. After playing a bunch of the top tier version, and now a few games of this version. I am genuinely unsure as to why the big long range SAMs need to exist in this game mode at all, or at least, why they need be both so numerous and also well defended when you do find them and try to take them out.
in general I find them to make the game generally more frustrating and annoying, rather than providing an interesting gameplay loop.
Those SAMs especially when combined with the close range SPAAs on the enemy ground targets themselves sort of just makes dumb bombs and many dumbfire rockets a bit pointless, you need guided weapons that you can fire from longer range.
AA seems to ignore bullpups like completely. So you can snipe shilka and eat rest of convoy/outpost safely.
Also 8 min of waiting for battle already
What a horrible take of someone who clearly hasn’t learned proper strategies to engage AI SAM sites.
You, good sir, are allowing a skill issue cloud your judgement, and PvE should not at all be made braindead easy.
SAM sites are a fantastically dynamic objective that allow a team to work towards the goal of ensuring high altitude safety - you can deal with them in a variety of ways, from ARMs at long ranges to gun/rocket runs while hugging the deck and using terrain, all aimed at targeting the radar module (which, if destroyed, disables the site).
Destroying all sites is a very fulfilling achievement with the reward of allowing the team to fly freely across the map at any altitudes - also allowing nuclear carriers to go high and avoid enemy interceptors.
The only issue I have with it is the performance difference between S75 and HAWK. HAWK is clearly the more oppressive system and this should be rebalanced.
Also, it’d be nice if they actually got the long range AN/TPS-59 / Nebo radars to work again. They seem to be broken right now and seem to serve no purpose in the game.
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I’ve kept suggesting they replace some of the tanks and IFVs on the frontline with light targets that can be destroyed by light bombs and even cannon fire. MG positions, mortar pits, light pillboxes, observation towers, stuff like that which stock planes can actually destroy and contribute to the event. It’s a good interim step of Gaijin does not or even can’t rework the AI targeting parameter to be less oppressive without becoming borderline useless.
The same can be applied for the deadzone areas behind the frontline. Convoys should be spawning from motor stating areas. There should be communication relays, fire direction centers, command and control bunkers, long range static artillery batteries… the kind of stuff that can operate under the protection of longer range SAM systems, offering much more tempting targets and increasing the worth of SEAD/DEAD.
Gaijin, please extend the event by a couple more days :(
3 Likes
Rewards need to change.
Executing a strike using conventional weapons and taking out a convoy should not yield the same amount of RP and SL as a dude in a nuke aircraft pressing the spacebar. Make the multipliers on par with AirRB otherwise this mode will become a place where people play once a while for fun if it ever becomes a permanent.
Making PvP rewards less to encourage people to actually play for objectives was a right move. Next logical step should be rewarding those who return from a mission. Give +%50 RP and SL earned to those actually do a mission and return back alive so people would have a reason to actually RTB and rearm other than for the immersion.
2 Likes
Today before the event ends I played as Britain at 10.0-11.0
I managed to squeeze in 11 matches
In all those matches I got teamed with the Soviet/Russia team
I lost all 11 of those matches.
I’m honestly surprised reading this posts comments and see people complaining about Mig25’s and 23’s yet from this experience can say Soviet/Russian is again getting dominated
So far as nuclear escalation goes I’ve played only the top tier brackets , 11.0-12.0 and 10.0-11.0 as Britain and I’ve lost the majority of those matches when teamed with Soviet/Russia
American teams have an overwhelming amount of Fighter jets while Soviet teams have more Strike Jets
Basically steamrolling and farming Soviet teams without much pushback. I don’t know what the fix for this could be. But it’s to much.
I’ve lost most of my matches .
Another this is the AAs expecially now with the m163 , I’ve never meet any player in Ground RB that intercepted guided munitions or managed to shot down a jet from 3-4km away… Never. So why is it AI can? Quite unbalanced. Having to waste 3+ guided munitions to maybe kill one single SPAA .
And I’m not gonna talk about the convoys that are moving so fast guided munitions will miss basically 100% of the time unless from a specific angle at a specific speed under ideal conditions.
I died too many times while dealing with a stationary target by a m163 from a convoy speeding at 40km/h or whatever the speed from 3-4km away while I was manoeuvering , disengaging.
Another problem is team coordination , there is none , it would be nice if there could be a way to coordinate with other players on how to approach a match more strategically, designating targets and points on the map where the team should focus more.
Also Nukes need a hard nerf, maybe in terms of SP. As it stand nukes just steamroll matches .
Another idea would be adding a nuke count .
Being able to see how many nuke jets the enemy team have operational at any given time , maybe encouraging player to be more on the look out and prepared to intercept them
Hopefully you gathered enough data to make this gamemode a little more bearable . As it stands it’s just frustrating
(Crazy I had this post hidden because ppl didn’t like how I expressed russian/soviet teams are subpar to American teams. )