I think that due to balancing reasons the Leopard 2A4M should receive DM53, because its lacking in comparison, since the premium M1A1HC Clickbait also got access to best USA ammunition. The turret armour [the arrowheads] should also be remodelled as composite instead of 10mm RHA, because currently it only provides protection almost identical to Leopard 2A4. I dont understand why the arrowheads are modelled as RHA in the first place, because every other Leopard variant with them has them modelled as composite armour. Maybe one of these changes could be enough because otherwise it could overperform
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More Canadian buff, +1
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thats HEAT protection, basically no one uses heat in this battle rating, and its pretty much irellevant, as i said, only thing that these arrowheads do on this tank is add 10mm RHA which functions as spaced armour, which doesnt improve protection that much against KE threats. I dont understand why is this the only leopard which has them modelled as RHA, should be composite.
I’ll never understand this thing people do.
People will confidently claim something when it’s so obviously wrong, and so easily verified by just spending 10 seconds in the game’s Protection Analysis feature.
It’s APFSDS.
Trust me its not that deep i just wrongly assumed and i dont want you to think that its your fault but you couldve atleast said something to it rather than commenting two screenshots without the shell type, ill never understand this thing where people dont provide info and then are surprised from someone assuming. I dont know which shell you are using here but i will assume that its the KE-W, which as you likely know i said its lacking compared to the premium abrams which has 600+mm of pen and will not have any trouble penetrating most of the turret. the right turret cheek is in fact very poorly armoured and offers protection less than 400mm on most places [against the M829A2]. So we summed it up and it seems like this tank lacks firepower and armour with the comparable mobility [compared to the abrams]
Like I said, it’s fine if you’re unsure about something, but you can simply verify it in about 10 seconds by checking the stats in-game.
HEAT protection values would also logically be significantly higher than the protection values I showed.
Penetration differences at top-tier are largely irrelevant, everybody’s aiming for the same spots anyways.
The M1’s are also undertiered, so they’re not the most fair point of comparison because you can make anything seem overtiered simply by comparing it to the M1A1 (HC) or M1A2.
Not true, it’s around 540mm vs KE (excluding optics).
The game engine gets confused by the FCS module that’s located in the centre of the composite armour, therefore it doesn’t count the composite armour located behind the FCS module.
KE-W or DM53 wont make that much of a difference. The Leopard has a clear advantage when it comes to the thermos. Having gen 3 thermos for the gunner and commander (Abrams doesnt even have commander sights at all) makes up for the lower pen and longer reload.
I dont think it compensates fully, so i would like to see alteast one of the suggested changes made
Its a huge advantage, especially not having commander sights with thermos is a big disadvantage of the Abrams. Overall both tanks a good for their BR and I guess its a matter of taste, what characteristics you prefer.
Yes thanks i think that is what is happening however from 500m the KEW can still pen even the place where there is the internal composite and if you shoot the lower side of the arrowhead you can pen it even from 2000m, but its a pretty small spot so i wouldnt say its quite important
Yeah when you adapt to the playstyle of this tank i think its actually pretty good and fun vehicle, but most of the maps are very small and this tank frontally is very easy to pen for most MBTs. And as i said it can be a good vehicle but i think in the format of GRB the abrams is just better at the same br so im suggesting changes
Well I can understand that you want the vehicle to perform better, but not every vehicle can be the best for its BR, sometimes you have to accept that a vehicles is just worse (Sometimes subjectively or objectively).
Just look at the VT4 its worse than the most 12.0 tanks yet it is 12.3. It sucks but thats the way it is. There needs to be bad and mediocre vehicoes for others to be good or the best.
Even with the KEW at 500m you can pen its LFP, entire UFP [altough it can be tricky and bounce shots] and big area of the turret. The side composite screen armour is very useful against auto cannons and atgms tho
I just realised that the Leopard 2PL is exactly what you are asking for. Slighly better turret armor and DM53 at 12.3.
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To be fair i dont even understand why does it use KEW, because thats USA round which is designed for USA use - the tank likely never even used it in real life. It has the L/44 gun which is compatible with the dm53 so i dont see an issue why wouldnt it be given that. I mean the premium abrams formerly used the m829a1 ammunition but it was changed to m829a2, i dont really see a problem why wouldnt they change the KEW for DM53
Yeah its a mess, i mean best option would be some BR decompression, make the changes, and move it up in BR to the same as the PL
KE-W is a US-made round meant specifically for export.
Yes i think with my suggestions [DM53 and composite arrowheads] it would probably be good to raise it up to 12.3, there even has been a bug report long ago with video of the tank with spall liners and it was accepted, but they never implemented it [im not asking for that because with the dm53, improved armour and spall liners it would have to be at top tier with the current BR, and its also not possible because gaijin doesnt want to add top tier premiums]. I also think they will implement these changes at some point, but that is probably not soon and would need serious BR decompression
As much as I think Leopard 2A4M should just get DM53 and be moved to 12.3, youre arguing on this the wrong way entirely.
Also no composite wedges since these arent composite.