KFIR C10 Block 60 The Colombian Sky Lion, Analysis and Discussion

[GranColombia]

Electronic Countermeasures (ECM) are now in the game.

I’d like to talk about the new mechanic that will finally be in the game and will possibly be added to aircraft, focusing on the Colombian Kfir C.10 Block 60.
Currently, the meta relies on active countermeasures (flares against IR and chaff against radar) for self-protection. In fact, the number of these countermeasures can be a significant factor in determining an aircraft’s Battle Rating (BR). But now, with a mechanic that realistically complements aircraft self-protection systems, this is going to change.
It’s still unclear how and in what way ECMs will be implemented in the game, but we need to know which aircraft will be able to use this mechanic and how.

There will be two types of ECM for aircraft:

1. ECM via a pod
2. Integrated ECM

I could list all the aircraft that will have this system, but we already know that the top tier will have integrated ECM, so I’ll get to the main point of my thread: What about the Kfir C.10? Will the Kfir C.10 Block 60 have integrated ECM or via a pod? Will the Kfir C.10 at least have ECM?
As we already know, in the Forum: Gaijin does what it always does. I must try to clarify a contradiction whose sources can only be understood through common sense, but with a little research, a suggestion faithful to reality can be given, since this topic has secrecy limitations.

Kfir C.10 Blk 60 ECM

To summarize what I’ve already said in this thread:
The Colombian Air Force (FAC) participated on several occasions in Exercise Red Flag in the US, where they gained a deeper understanding of the usefulness of ECM and Electronic Warfare (EW) systems.

Following this, in the 2018 exercise, the Kfir squadron was seen using Israeli ECM pods (EL/L 8222) for the first time.

However, if we look closely, the Kfir C.10 variant was NOT Block 60. This pod was loaned by the Israeli company ELTA Systems for the exercise in question. After this, another modernization was implemented on the Colombian Kfirs, in which ECM and EW systems were installed in an integrated manner. This is why these antennas are now seen, including all variants (C.10, C.12, Block 60, and TC.10/12).

@GranColombia

EMERALD AES-212 (EW)
The EMERALD AES-212 is an operational and field-proven ESM/ELINT system optimized for various types of manned and unmanned marine and aerial platforms. Based on the most advanced technologies, EMERALD AES-212 simultaneously detects and identifies multiple radars and their direction, including target positioning (for aerial applications).
It acquires radar signals at a very high level of accuracy, clearly distinguishes between them, and identifies them according to a predefined mission library. It measures the electronic parameters emitted by each radar, rapidly processes the data, and graphically displays it for the operator in real time. The system can be integrated with stand-off jamming capabilities as part of a mission aircraft suite for combined EW and Intelligence missions.
SPECTROLITE SPS-65-V-5 (ECM)
Spectrolite’s “All in One” state-of-the-art, incorporating flexible architecture of latest proven Integrated Digital receivers design. It maintains peak operational combat readiness to maximize the investment with continuously adapting to new threat environments and extended life cycle. Integrated for 3 subsystems:

• SPS-20, a Wide Band Digital Receiver which detects Pulse & CW radars within the low band to 18 GHz frequency range.
• NBDR-25, a Narrow Band Digital Receiver add-on to the SPS-20 for detecting CW, high PRF and low ERP radars
• LWS-20 sensors which receive laser pulses aimed at the aircraft, processed by the SPS-20 Analyzer provide IR MWS.

All systems are integrated and displayed on the aircraft’s MFDs as well as on the helmet. The following antennas are part of these possible systems, differentiating the RWR system from the EW and LWS, and the communications and DataLink antenna:

Therefore, in conclusion, I truly hope and have high hopes, because of my affection for the game and its “realism”, as well as the good fortune of having such an iconic vehicle for us, that the Snail will not disappoint us by adding the ECM pod or by not adding anything to the powerful Kfir C.10 Blk 60.
Postscript: This is another reason why the Kfir C.10 can easily carry its iconic armament (Python 4/5 and I-Derby-ER) and fly in the Br it belongs to.

Sources

Spoiler

fac.co
IAI.com

[Beeschurger]

@GranColombia

that the Snail will not disappoint us by adding the ECM pod

ECM will be anything but fun in context of ARB.

[noister]

Everything mentioned here is kind off just passive ecm, ESM (detection), maws lws rwr etc.

the only jammers are via pods, and they take up the already limited amount of pylons on the plane

[noister]

scrap ARB

we beg for permanent nuclear thunder version 🙏

[GranColombia]

I don’t think that’s entirely true. Jammers are also integrated into the aircraft’s ECM system, like the Spectra system for Rafale or Praetorian (DCSS) for Typhoon. But, as I’ve also mentioned, there are cases like the F-18G Growler that use pods. And they can be considered passive detection systems, but also active ones due to the interference.
I have suggested that the SPECTROLITE SPS-45(V) system may be integrated into the Kfir C.10 Block 60, but as is often the case with Israeli technology, there is confidentiality surrounding these matters.

[GranColombia]

The Kfir C.10 will now have a Br increase from 13 to 13.3 (RB). But unlike other aircraft such as the F-14A IRIAF, which will receive a buff to justify its Br increase (6 Fakours!!), the Kfir will receive NOTHING. I believe it’s time to add modern avionics to the Kfir C.10 Block 60 to justify its upgrade:
Modern RWR: SPS-45 (V)
Community Bug Reporting System (Accepted)
Datalink: Link-16.
(DEV) Targo 2/JHMCS 2 hmd missing “blue forces tracker” // Gaijin.net // Issues (Accpeted)
(DEV) Targo 2/JHMCS 2 hmd missing Display of threats // Gaijin.net // Issues (Accepted)
Kfir C.10 Block 60 Missing Data Link Capabilities // Gaijin.net // Issues
As we’ve discussed at length, the Kfir C.10 Block 60 WAS MODERNIZED! and these reports are based on the aircraft’s historical record. These are features that will help the aircraft be more competitive against its peers in the BR it will now face.
Please support us in making the game more realistic.

[SoyBeanInhaler]

Needs MAWS and I-Derby ER

[Mr_Kiryu]

It never had MAWS IRL, after checking with Elisra’s archived website and several other resources, it was confirmed that the SPS-45(V) never included a MAW.

[Mr_Kiryu]

Thank god my dear Kfir C.10 will remain at 13.0 Sim

[GranColombia]

The MAWS might not actually be integrated into the Kfir C.10 (I’ve researched this extensively, and everything seems to indicate that’s the case). The suite that was integrated during the Kfir C.10 modernization was the SPS-45(V), which doesn’t have the LWS-20 (MAW) subsystem.

However, it does have a modern RWR and ECM and ESM capabilities.

On the other hand, the I-Derby ER missile (which I agree the Kfir should have) isn’t yet available for aircraft. That’s why I think the increased Br will be offset by improved avionics.

[GranColombia]

Perhaps not for long

[Mr_Kiryu]

For further understanding, while Gran Colombia’s information is partially correct, the correct sensor integrated into the Kfir electronic suite is the SPS-45(V), which is (in broad terms) the SPS-65(V) without the LWS-20.

[Mr_Kiryu]

If they’re gonna increase the Sim BR I expect it to receive AT LEAST the Sensor Fusion + Data Link that the real Kfir C.10 Block 60 has.

[GranColombia]

@Mr_Kiryu

For further understanding, while Gran Colombia’s information is partially correct, the correct sensor integrated into the Kfir electronic suite is the SPS-45(V), which is (in broad terms) the SPS-65(V) without the LWS-20.

I just fixed the main thread, bro :D

@Mr_Kiryu

If they’re gonna increase the Sim BR I expect it to receive AT LEAST the Sensor Fusion + Data Link that the real Kfir C.10 Block 60 has.

Of course, these are indeed historical characteristics of the real aircraft.

[Mr_Kiryu]

@GranColombia

I just fixed the main thread, bro :D

Nice

@GranColombia

Of course, these are indeed historical characteristics of the real aircraft.

Which often begs the question, what is the limiting factor behind not adding this capability?

It’s like baking a cake without flour, makes no sense since it is the key thing that makes it a modern aircraft.

[GranColombia]

I don’t like to speak ill of things because the game is free and they gave us the plane for free, but the truth is that they basically took the Kfir C.7 and added those small changes (Radar, Derby missiles, Hmd and that’s it). But I remain hopeful that we will be heard so that the Kfir C.10 Blk 60 will truly be a Kfir C.10 Blk 60.

[Mr_Kiryu]

Me too, hopefully it will receive every missing capability and every missing MFD page.

[SoyBeanInhaler]

unfortunate, will have to settle for I-Derby ER then. I doubt SPS-45(V)6 or 5 or whatever will be any different gameplay wise than SPS-200, which is already a perfectly fine RWR.

also datalink would be incredibly helpful

[GranColombia]

Of course, but bro, the SPS-200 is very old; in fact, it’s been around since the C.2 variant (1970s). Let me briefly explain why the SPS-45 would be much better than the old RWR that the Kfir C.10 mistakenly has:
SPS-200: C.2 and C.7
SPS-20 (V): MiG-29 Sniper
SPS-45 (V): Should be on the Kfir C.10
SPS-65 (V): with MAWS
SPS-1000: F-16I and F-15I (Should be on the Ra’am)
So the SPS-45 (V) would give the Kfir a modest RWR that’s better than the previous one, with 360-degree coverage capability, and it’s also part of the EW suite with the SPJ-20 Jammer and EMERALD AES-212

[Mr_Kiryu]

Actually, if we take a look at the EW layout the Kfir C.10 Block 60 you’ll see it is fitted with quite the capabilities.

We have of course the SPS-45(V)6, which is comprised of the following components:

• SPS-20(V): signal analyzer which covers from 0,5 to 18 GHz (Up to NATO J band in War Thunder terms)

• SRS-25: signal receiver for high PRF and low power radars

Note: This image belongs to the SPS-1000V-5 suite which contains the SRS-25, this is merely used for reference rather than direct relation.

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These two subsystems are the base for the SPS-45(V), however the Kfir is also fitted with the following extra EW systems:

• SPJ-20(V): Self protection jammer with wide band frequency range

Author's Clarification

Note: This image is likely taken from a previous and/or older of the SPJ-20, as modern versions, have been described as follows: “it utilises CW repeater, pulse repeater, two RF sources as ECM resources.” [THE CONCISE GLOBAL INDUSTRY GUIDE RADAR AND ELECTRONIC WARFARE SYSTEMS HANDBOOK – Issue 1, April 2022]

I believe said “RF Sources” are likely a refence to these “lobes”, which look as follow:

The likely “jamming” lobes found as described for the modern SPJ-20

Reference image from India’s jammers fitted on their MiG-29’s

• AES-212: ESM / ELINT System which provides a coverage from 0,1Ghz up to 40Ghz (Up to NATO K band in War Thunder terms)

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And to top it all of, ALL of these integrated sub-systems provide a 360° coverage as stated in Elisra’s (and later on Elbit) website and promotional material.

Also, in regards to the Data Link, it’s more of a feature when it comes to simulator, this is due to the Sensor Fusion advertised by IAI when they pitched the Block 60 upgrade, here are a few reference images regarding said function:

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Sensor Fusion + Data Link Images