Realistic boat battles are plagued by a variety of issues which limit the playability of the game. Some are: Extreme BR over compression; e.g. being at 1.7 with a possible +1 uptier pits a PT-20 against a Pr.1204 late. Unbalanced trees and vehicles; SKR-7(totally OP) vs USS Asheville (tissue paper armor and a worthless gun) or USS Cyclone (which should be a BR 2.0 not 3.7) with an uptier. Unbalanced gameplay maps: Allowing blue water destroyers to fight against PT’s that just do not have a prayer of winning or surviving. And finally AI vehicles that steal cap points, rob players of kill credits and shoot down aircraft at distances greater than 4000m.
What can be done ? These things immediately come to mind:
Massively decompress the BR in the tech trees
Introduce new boats to lower BR trees that have been long ignored (e.g. USN)
Do not allow boats to fight vs blue water in boat only matches OR give them better means such as
improved artillery fire (faster recharge, more damage and greater range)
Nerf the OP trees; of which which USSR would be a great start.
Constrain and nerf the AI boats AA range and power, forbid them to take cap points, or hit planes
beyond 3000m.
Any or all of these things would make Coastal more playable and fun again. Thoughts?
Just started playing naval, can’t say much about anything but for a fact coastal is boring and underperforming in game.
Also when submarines come to game? :(
there is no such thing as “boat vs boat games”, and at low BR’s the reserve DD’s are easy meat for any PT boats right down to the reserves.
At higher BR’s make yourself competitive lineups that include your own ships at that BR ffs… people complain about fighting DD’s with boats - well that is YOUR CHOICE TO DO SO… nothing at all stops you from bringing your own ships, and using better vessels for the job at ahand!
That which is asserted without evidence can be denied without evidence.
AI capping and decapping is one of hte great improvements in the last year .
Only decompressing BR’s would actually be useful - the rest are L2P and skill issues.
I am just angri, and write over realistic battles. I know except a few maniac anyone playing tanks/planes. The game was started many years ago, at least planed to, have all 3 main arms, including navy. Its got long, but slowly we have some fisching boats in the game. i understand the battles are wastly different scale. a tank shoot for 2+km, a plane cut of the fly to and back 5-10km grid and run out of fuel, a battle ship in ww1 shoot 5 nautical miles, a ww2 batleship shoot 5-10 nautical miles, a torpedo 2-5 km and you decide not to put cv’s and submarin’s to battle because to far and to slow for dirext battle.
What you have built so fahr is not bad except is not to play. coastal boat at least are 90% turky hunt, a few exception the dd/light cruser(?) need to got close to isles, or the captian is slepping. If i use DD i can accept being killed by similar forces (light crusers are still a bit hars for old first dd’s). But minelayer, and subchaser are 90+% useless again any minimali armored targets ther are mostly from paper having a few 88 or 100+ mm caliber guns. What make short order again motorboats, but i can only sweep the decks from a dd. even if ther is anti shipping missile decoraton on it. the antiair rockets in theory working 5km range what 2km in “reality” The only usable surviving tactic sitting behind some island and waiting someone got bored and leave ther island (because bases dont cap them self).
Weapons, the first reserve boats got some big mg and torp/mine its a nice toy, higher 20-30mm autoguns what a bit better crew got not so long empty and you wait for reload and put cork’s into lot of new hole’s on your ship. yes ther are deadly for coastal wessels. If you got a canon i meain something over 70mm are mostly behinde some metals sheet (to be fair a little bit higher fire rate; and excep russian armored tank turrets) and alot higher ammohit possibility. ther are newly some missile holder what is unguided but around unknow amont of katyusa’son the board, and one time i was killer more time from guided rocket idland hugging LC send it. Yes i got sunk dd’s a few light crueser mostly if ther shoot someone else, or over 2km having luck by aming behind island’s newer face to face fully healty ship duels (even if i tend to clear the target guns first).
Its just broken to fight coastal fleet wessels again blue water wessel, to be a turky to got less waiting time. What 2-7 min or just 4 people in the time period; want to play ships what i can understand.
Puting AI/KI/MI driven boats to battle because ther need balance to the player’s ability in the battle. You have a focus on coldwar airplans/heli’s, and put some only blueprint tanks into game, or some nation copy paste. I know i have not payed for playing but patiently let me kill from some golden wechiles to exchange.
The issue for me, is that they treat coastal as both the BR1-4 of naval as a whole and as its own entire tree/gamemode with BR1-4 being the same as BR1-13.7 is for air.
This means the economy makes absolutely no sense and you end up with premium coastal frigates that cost 6x more than premium destroyers but vastly weaker in both performance and economy for no given reason and yet they’ll face each other all day long. Either they need to be 2 totally seperate gamemodes or they need to be re-merged into one and treated as such. The economy at top tier cosatal is just deeply frustrating and an absolute slog.
Combine with coastal boats fighting destroyers and light cruisers and the issues just get worse.
Be that as it may, JP echos what the majority of top end players think. This can be further had by checking their stats which show high end coastal being at or near the top line.
As a decent and legit player I do not begrudge JP’s opinion, in fact I welcome it. Of course, playing the “skill level” card is the ultimate indefensible cheap shot, and he plays it a lot.
Usually, I have found, that these debates sometimes come down to those who what the game to improve and change for the better, and those who benefit from the way it is, or Status Quo. I would like to believe I am in the former category, not the latter.
However, anytime someone pretends to be the voice of the community without polling data is flat out wrong. Also win rate stats mean nothing because winning a random match outside of a squadron battle is beyond the control of the individual. Further, there have been, unfortunately, too many ‘High End’ players who got there by unethical means, and appeared as bright stars, until they ended up on the ban list. Also ‘High End’ is a disparaging term that is very condescending, the only purpose is to assume an air of authority that doesn’t exist. The only real authority here is with the Forum Moderators, everything else is just opinion.
Lastly having played the game myself since 2018, I want to see it fun for everyone, including new players. And at the end of the day, everyone is entitled to ‘spawn’ (or spew) their opinion as they see fit.
Now how about the topic, which is regarding new coastal vehicles, balancing existing ones, BR decompression, and limiting AI AA accuracy?
Nope - it is fact - you get to choose what is in your lineup and what you spawn.
If it is a DD-heavy game and you choose to spawn boats then that is your choice.
Let’s look at he complaints:
1/ - Decompression - I agree
2/ - new boats at lower BR - I don’t see how this would change the problem that is identified
3/ - No ships in “boat vs boat games” - well there are no “boat vs boat games” as such, and even if there were the larger boats wipe out smaller boats even faster than the lower BR DD’s do, and it is STILL YOUR CHOICE WHAT TO FIELD AND SPAWN
4/ - “Nerf the OP trees” - now THAT is pure opinion and stated without evidence that there are any OP trees. SKR’s are countered by DD’s for example - so this particular topic jsut contradicts itself!
5/ a few things about constraining AI boats that seem to show that the AI is better at these than the player is …
So out of the 5 points 1 is universal, 2 are meaningless, and 2 are clear issues with how the player plays the game - which is the very definition of skill issue.
And if I raise “L2P/skill issue” often it is because the idea that he game has to change because someone doesn’t want to have to actually get any skill as witnessed by this thread.
Yup thanks for sharing. Here’s the central part of your argument - There are no ‘boat only battles’. If one is to assume this to be true, your points have merit. Except, I do not. Your point is in how the current state of the game is fine for you and a few others. Mine is how I believe (as do others as well) what the game should be. Is that opinion? Of course it is. Your faction wants it to stay the way it is, and you are using that as a basis of argument, which is your opinion - This is up to, and including not nerfing the SKR-7. I do not believe destroyers should be fighting boats. You say they should be, and that counters the SKR and the other OP Russian tank boats, and that is fine. If your point is true then every battle is a blue water battle, which it is not. If it was, then having a separate Coastal tree makes no sense. It’s circular argument → Basically your saying If Coastal is imbalanced just use a blue water ship, so then Coastal isn’t imbalanced. And then you play the “skill level git-gud” card to rationalize it. As for AI boats shooting you down at 15,000 feet with a 12.7mm MG, that has nothing to do with skill and everything to do with balance. As for introducing new mid and low tier boats, ( e.g. Eagle class; Eagle-class patrol craft - Wikipedia ) the point is to add fun and fill up a decompressed tree, if and when it does get decompressed.
its realy hard to got experince point into parts, if you just cant play the wessel because 95% of the battles are heavy DD LC heavy battles. Even if i have some succes white DD’s :D
The main difference between a ship and boat is armor. even a splinter proof “armor” is a big difference. 95+% of boats dont have armor, glascanons or fast boats, some mine layer have “armor” still ther have open gunsslot and limited gun number to a DD compared.
And size - sheer size makes even the smallest “ships” a lot more damage tolerant than most boats.
But irrelevant to my point - which is your lineups need to include a variety of vessels to address a variety of threats - if you only have a bottle opener then you are in trouble if you have to open cans…
"And size - sheer size makes even the smallest “ships” a lot more damage tolerant than most boats.
But irrelevant to my point - which is your lineups need to include a variety of vessels to address a variety of threats - if you only have a bottle opener then you are in trouble if you have to open cans…"
coldwar subchaser, minelayer are similar size to DD equiped mostly white autoguns on dd maybe mid caliber, much higher firerate (+reloadtime after a while) and wariety of weapon, 5km antiair rocket, torps, mines, deepcharges… The deepcharg incredily deadly if you got close enough. Mines are more deadly to you because by hit expodieren, antiair misseile need radar lock what is slow and somehow only work by 1 km, if the plane fly more or less linear is mostly dead, torps wariing but hav 4km short range to. The player mostly not fully dumb any he hit take you part of a crue to death including mg fire on subchaser.
Do you think that i can call resistant, and small? :D Still your idee play white necessary wessel, in this case the top part of your coastal ships got exp in 5% the battles what do íou thimk how long would that make them full researched? i have the first dd’s all expert goldes star only from battles, and not even all the wessel’s unlocked on the tree (german).