How many top tier SPAAs have smoke?
Do you even play top tier?
Actually, it’s the only solution against a non-braindead SM SV player.
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/oveWeVjZwJ8
Unless GJ models pK, all of this is just academic blah-di-blah…
You are completely missing the point by shifting the argument from weapon technical specs to highly specific tactical workarounds.
First of all, assuming that a top-tier anti-air umbrella will just let you fly low and pull off a fast climb right over the enemy ground spawn is completely unrealistic. Even if you manage to enter the radar’s blind cone, systems like the Pantsir, FlaRakRad, and ADATS don’t rely solely on radar tracking. They have advanced thermal and optical-electronic tracking systems (OFS). An alert player will easily lock your jet manually on a thermal channel and swat you out of the sky before you can drop anything.
Secondly, you miscalculated the payload — it is 18 Brimstones (6 hardpoints x 3 missiles), not 16.
But more importantly, my argument from the very beginning has been about tactical parity and engagement range equity. Platforms like the Su-30 or US top-tier jets have access to true Fire-and-Forget standoff weapons (such as the Kh-38MT or Maverick series) that allow them to engage from safer distances without being forced into high-risk, low-altitude infiltration.
The entire purpose of discussing the historical MMW active radar Brimstones is to give Eurocanards their legitimate standoff capability to counter the current 12.3 - 12.7 multi-channel SPAA meta, rather than forcing players to rely on gimmicky, close-range rush tactics. This is about establishing balanced weapon categories across all top-tier nations, not about “Germany suffering.”
Yeh, anyway.
Lets pretend it would come in current state.
And then come next artificial nerf, limiting them on 6 missiles. It would be fine, but having 18 F&F A2G radarhoming in a jet, Not going to happen anytime soon .
You only play top tier in SPAA? Lmurs / 179’s etc only targeting AA’s.
And none multiplatform got smokes.
but 11.7-12.7 range there might be 4 or 5 if i remember right.
And usually playing 12.7 usa or 12.0 china, nowdays
CS/SA5, FlaRak, Buk, Pantsir SM-SV and ADATS does have
Let me help you. None of the top tier SPAAs have smoke, except maybe Russian.
So, once the SPAAs are gone, the team is toast. Not sure when you played top tier last time, but your outlook is outdated.
Anyway, you have a video of Pantsir SMSV, where the guy takes out 10 JAGMs and shoots 5-6 SPICE250s while shooting at the launching EF too.
I don’t see why the Russians wouldn’t have to hide a bit behind the houses, when NATO already has to, although I get killed behind the house too, so that point is rather moot.
Adats got only ess so works only against 29T’s so it is nearly useless.
Yea, a nice video of prime example of so braindead cas players.
Just fly straight against enemy pantsir :D
Nice that you post a video how to not use CAS on top tier.
And on jagms , that is your best bet just try to supress enemy AA. 16 pieces of those keeps em busy usually for a moment, reload and repeat after 15s.
Funny enough last time is today. Not sure about you since you cant even post on your main account :D
Unlike you, who have 0.025 and 0.18 kill ratio in NATO planes against ground targets, in top tier?
Claiming that ADATS is “nearly useless” because it uses electro-optical tracking (OFS) is factually incorrect. Thermal/optical tracking allows systems like ADATS and Pantsir to lock and engage aircraft without triggering RWR alerts at all, making low-altitude or close-range pop-ups even more lethal for the pilot.
Furthermore, arguing that 18 F&F radar missiles is an impossible balance-breaker remains peak double standards when the F-15E can currently spawn with 20x GBU-39/B (SDB I). These are high-capacity, satellite-guided Fire-and-Forget weapons that allow a player to dump a massive autonomous salvo from complete safety while the jet breaks away.
If having 20 independent precision F&F weapons on a US platform fits the meta, then rejecting Brimstones for Eurocanards is pure hypocrisy. As @GJ04 mentioned, top-tier SPAAs like the Pantsir SM-SV can already intercept an absurd amount of incoming munitions (like multiple JAGMs and Spice bombs simultaneously) while engaging the jet itself.
To address balance concerns, the developers could easily cap the Brimstone loadout to 12 missiles (4 pods of 3). This aligns perfectly with the multi-launcher interception limits of top-tier SPAA networks (which can track and engage 6 to 12 targets), turning the engagement into a skill-based tactical duel rather than a one-sided slaughter. It provides a fair, high-speed standoff counter for other nations without exceeding payloads already abused by US and Soviet lineups.
TBH, 18 active Brimstones would be a problem…a year and a half ago.
However, considering what GJ introduced since, it’s about time Brimstones go active.
I mean, stats don’t lie.
Are you slow or what?
We were talking about smokes on adats what are nearly useless. Since it only works against TV seekers, not IR.
Yes exactly. You cant even compare semiDumb bombs on a goddamn radar quided missile. !
GPS quided, drop where you point , end of story and they glide on that position relatively slow. (unless dropped from complete 90 angle over enemy spawn.
Compared to 18 missiles what are tracking enemy after launch.
Atm USA got 4/6 truly F&F missiles on top tier ( mavericks) depending are you using F16, F15 or F18
And in current state, tracking is either IR or TV quided. Both can be fooled relatively easily unlike mmWR
Only used on ground games. Right ;)
Well, IDK. I see what there is…and there’s not a lot.
Why don’t you show us, how to kill a non-braindead SMSV player, then?
Actually, they’re not. They track last 5km, or so. The rest is INS guided.
First of all, let’s keep this discussion civil and avoid personal insults — we are here to discuss game mechanics and tactical balance, not each other.
Secondly, calling GPS/GNSS weapons like the GBU-39 “semi-dumb” because they target fixed coordinates completely ignores how they are actually utilized in the top-tier meta. Yes, GNSS munitions lock onto a point rather than tracking a moving vehicle, but when a platform can ripple-fire 20 of them into a grid layout, spawn zone, or known SPAA positions from complete safety, it completely oversaturates the battlefield. It forces ground networks to constantly reposition or waste all their ammunition intercepting a cloud of gliding bombs.
Suggesting that Western 4++ platforms should have zero active radar-guided counters just because GNSS requires coordinate-locking is a flawed premise. Limiting a Brimstone payload to 12 missiles perfectly bridges this gap. It creates a dynamic where a pilot has an active weapon to challenge high-BR, multi-channel threats — from the widely accessible Pantsir-C1 setups to the top-tier Pantsir SM-SV or Buk-M3 complexes — in a direct tactical duel, rather than being forced into unrealistic, close-range low-altitude rushes. This is about establishing healthy, cross-nation balance, not preserving the comfort of a single playstyle.
P.S. It seems you are also confusing the baseline Brimstone with the later Brimstone 2 (Dual-Mode). As @GJ04 accurately pointed out, the original millimetric-wave (mmW) Brimstone does not “track the enemy right after launch” across the whole map. It flies the vast majority of its trajectory on pure inertial guidance (INS) toward a designated grid sector. The active radar seeker only turns on during the terminal phase (the last few kilometers) to search for targets within that specific zone. If a tank moves out of that search area during the missile’s flight, it won’t be hit. Knowing the actual mechanics of the weapon completely dispels the myth that it would be an un-counterable, map-wiping tool.
Why are you arguing with a bot lol (he uses AI)
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ну так может я по английскому не шпарю
кривой перевод будет, да, я аргументирую через нейронку
Brimstone launched from 16km (3kmASL/M1.1) takes about 50sec to reach the target, almost a whole minute. Of that it’d be guided last 15, or so, seconds. It has a minuscule warhead (like PARS 3 LR) and MMW radar, which is inherently less accurate than the IIR (being longer wave).
I’d really like to hear where’s the problem?
Hello.
As we recently already answered, MMw is not planned anytime soon for Brimstone for a number if reasons. Its not comparable to any of the Fire and Forget type weapons we have in game, and would be something that would bring an entirely new type of weapon into the game for several nations. Not just Brimstone MMw.
MMw is very different to the operational uses we have introduced to missiles this major update with the MITL feature and their aspect of LOAL is not the same as the concerns still raised by Brimstone. Mainly:
Missiles are launched in an area and home in on any target within that area, including allies. Target acquisition occurs over a large area. Brimstone cannot discriminate in many cases and can destroy allies.
There are significant gaps in the ability to evade these missiles. Regular smoke screens don’t provide coverage from its radar. Only some specific smoke screens with chaff reflectors, but they’re experimental and very limited.
We have a “sterile” jamming environment; objects on the map that would actually disrupt lock-on have no effect on the radar seekers of missiles.
This is also why we don’t allow anti-radar missiles to be launched using coordinates and locked on in flight, as there’s a high chance of hitting allied units.
As such, the conditions and primary reasons for why MMw and the other modes of Brimstone have not yet been introduced and will not be introduced anytime soon in conventional battles
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