So the HSTVL was nerfed yet again with the addition of the turret rotation basket yet they completely ignore the wrong reload speed, wrong ammo velocity, wrong ammo penetration and wrong ammo weight.
Typical gaijin response trying to get any of these fixed.
https://community.gaijin.net/issues/p/warthunder/i/FLiu6HYmtbfh
The ammunition velocity is correct for the tested non-overcharged ammunition, which means its penetration is also correct.
Its reload is correct enough.
Ammo weight is correct.
HSTVL was already the 2nd best light tank, and this changes nothing.
It has the same new weakness as 2S38 and Begleit now no matter how correct or incorrect they are.
they dont care about the u.s tech tree so what do you expect? Simply look at M735 and how they still haven’t corrected it
People when they cry out for realism and Gaijin makes the tank more realistic…
Honestly tho, you can thank the people who say “well ackshually I found this document that states the distance between the return roller and idler wheel is 15.03628cm and not 15.03629cm”
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What i care about is the fact gaijin thinks a metal turret basket can stop the entire turret ring from working
They did the same thing to the lav-ad now too
HSTV-L lowkey kinda sad. dunno if its a skill issue but a HSTV-L dumped all his ammunition on my BVM, and I survived, albeit it was very close range. I J’d out as I wanted to do some CAP
The thing is, this change isn’t even realistic. What they just called a horizontal drive is just a couple millimeter thick piece of metal that just stops the turret crew from getting injured by anything while the turret is rotating. It’s not a horizontal drive. Last I checked, the KF-41 is the only vehicle in the game that has a correctly modeled turret basket
The framing of that statement is false and misleading. There existed no “overcharged” ammunition or any terminology that stated it was above normal. It is best for everyone to know that there were two different propellant configuration during testing. Both of these were considered standard propellant configurations.
-
Designated M26 which has Total Charge Weight: 2,380 grams M26 stick propellant + 250 grains black powder booster
-
Designated M26/30 which as a Total Charge Weight: 2,190 grams total (512g M26 stick + 1,678g M30 chopped) + 250 grains black powder booster
Testing concluded that despite higher chamber pressures, M26/M30 had lower velocity than M26. Note that all test rounds used 4.9lb TP (training projectile) aluminum/steel projectile configuration not Delta 3 (XM885)
- M26: 4,950 ft/sec = 1,509 m/s
- M26/M30: 4,850 ft/sec = 1,478 m/s
Multiple official sources state that the cannon has a muzzle velocity of 5300 ft/sec. In addition, when Delta 3 (XM885) was tested it was shown to have armor penetrations characteristics equivalent to 105mm APFSDS M774
So yes thought the ammunition velocity is correct, it is not referring to the Delta 3 (XM885) hence why the HSTVL’s main round is incorrect.
“Correct enough”? Either it’s correct or incorrect. That’s such a terrible way to word it.
One source says that during tests, they fired approximately 100 rounds per minute, they also referenced 120 rounds per minute. But most tests were done in 5 round bursts at around 100 rounds per minute. what we have in game takes 150% longer to reload a shell
Another source says that during tests, they did a 3 round burst with 1 second interval. that’s is a 60 rounds per minute. What we have in game takes 50% longer to reload a shell
Yup but every other major part of the shell is wrong.
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They literally tested barrel wear using ammunition that was given the maximum safe charge of propellant, and fired ~20 or so rounds of it through a barrel.
That ammunition test is also what gave the “M833 like performance”. However, the ammunition was designed for barrel wear testing and of course was never going to be used in a production vehicle.
1.5 seconds is fast enough, I wouldn’t fire faster than that even if the reload was faster cause it’s already firing meta ammo at that BR.
Big difference between Delta 3 and Delta 6. Again, what we have in game is not Delta 3, it is some prototype round or whatever that is called Delta 3. Hence why people calling the round incorrect is factually true.
Then don’t call it “correct enough”. Say that it’s incorrect and it’s for balance. We can have a debate on that
You know, you could just say the hstvl is inaccurate and making it accurate would make it broken or unbalanced instead of playing all this mental gymnastics.
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Yup.
Watched the threads on here begging for interiors of light tanks to be modelled so that they would have components that could be damaged on penetration, namely people begging for it to happen to the 2S38.
Gaijin relent and agree to model interior components.
This starts to get rolled out to all vehicles and not just the cherrypicked ones that people are complaining about.
And then we are here.
I don’t see a problem though, I think the interior models that are being made are quite good and a good change for the game.
The US testing department in their infinite wisdom called multiple propellant rounds “Delta 3”.
The velocity we have IS correct for one of the rounds notably used. That’s the thing.
Again, the source that says it has a muzzle velocity of 4800fps doesn’t specify what round it uses and we cannot collaborate sources (because there is none) to make an educated guess.
Where for this, we have multiple sources states that the cannon has a muzzle velocity of 5300fps and one says that a DU round has a muzzle velocity of 5300fps. This lines up with Delta 3.
My biggest issue with this change, is that they didn’t compensate the HSTVL when they added internal modules, where as with the 2S38 they did (removed ready rack entirely).
That turret ring doesn’t look accurate at all though
2S38 shouldn’t have come with a ready rack to begin with and would’ve lost it regardless cause Gaijin found out it doesn’t have one while researching its internal modules [we as players knew it didn’t have one before 2S38 was added to the game].
It is an issue that it’s not seen as just a turret basket, and is a reportable historical issue.
And as with the 2S38 and HSTVL being incorrectly given ready racks when they shouldn’t have been, this is one of those situations where HSTVL shouldn’t have had its turret drive as part of the turret basket.
That’s the point, it was a historically accurate change and a major buff as well. I have no issues with it. I don’t see any issues fixing it’s Delta 3 (XM885) round or increasing it’s rof after internal modules was added to the hstvl
Giving HSTVL its higher powder charge rounds would make it 12.0 - 12.3 instantly.
And ROF would make players worse in it sadly.
HSTVL was already tied with CV90120 as best light tank at top BR, this change doesn’t change that cause if you’re shot to begin with you misplayed.
I am tired of people going straight to onion layer 4 instead of starting at 1: Don’t be seen.
Tank combat is infinitely more than just getting hit and penetrated.
I’m talking about Delta 3 round, not delta 6. We have no evidence that delta 3 had different propellant configurations and was still being called delta 3. Again the sources that say that it has 4800fps doesn’t specify what DU penetrator it uses and we don’t have sources to collobarate to prove that it did. Where as we do for the Delta 3.
Giving it a faster ROF will make terrible players struggle because it’ll just be spray and pray. but for the players that do good in it already, they will take advantage of that
Chinese mains crying that a chinese mbt is “unplayable” and “worst mbt at its br” because its hull is 5 cm too low.
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They kinda care but they have so many things that isnt properly implemented that theyre drowned in bug reports…