German WW2 bracket SPAAs need more penetration

After the latest addition of this Leopard 1 SPAA to italy with almost 100mm pen @ just BR 5.0, I just refined the pen values of all SPAA vehicles up to BR 7. Its pretty depressing that all German SPAAs have that much less penetration power than its russian, US, italian etc pendants. Its always around 50mm pen. Even the Kugelblitz got butchered and is almost not worth the BR anymore. Was there a specific reason why the pen of Ger autocannons got reduced that much? Why have other nations that much penetration at rather low BRs? So they can even gun down medium tanks from all sides and heavy ones from through the side armor? While German ones can’t even penetrate the sides or the rear of mediums? Like Italy rushes with super Leopard 1 speed and blasts its way through Tigers, Panters, Shermans, T-34 etc with nonstop autofire, while Ostwind’s can’t even disable the engine of a T-34.

Its kind of unbalanced.

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you know I don’t think the answer to “one country’s SPAA is OP” is to go “buff a single other country’s SPAA”


Yes, Leopard 40/70 is unbalanced at 5.0, how did you know ?

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give the ostwind 2 simply the hvap round from the stuka

Why can’t Wirbelwind get its 64mm historical pen back? Its so damn useless with just this made off 49mm pen. And the Sd.kfz 234/21 with is AP also had alot more pen historically. Ostwinds don’t even have its Hvap round for a reason. Where are the 98mm historical pen of the Kugel? Its IS unbalanced when others easily sport 70mm pen at these BR brackets…or 80…or 90…

Just drive out a Panther or Panzer IV or even Tiger… 3…2…1 bamm bamm bamm bamm dead by AA fire.

Because they never had them 🤷‍♂️

Oh no.

So the soluation is that Shermans, KV-1s and T-34-85 and all the other medium and heavy tanks should also be much more easy to kill by German SPAA.

That’s a bunch of Bull.

“Never had them” is not really a completely valid reason given that you can find examples of vehicles using rounds/projectiles that they never had (T-44-100 and T-34-100 firing BR-412D APCBC; SU-122P firing BR-471D APCBC; F-89D launching proximity fuse rockets; Sherman II firing T45 APCR).

Gaijin simply does not care if the vehicle actually fired any specific projectile. So long as it was possible for said projectile to be fired from that vehicle, then it can potentially be added.

Of course, if the German SPAAs got higher penetration rounds, they should absolutely be higher BR than what they are right now. Specially the case for the 37 mm SPAAs since the 37 mm APCR has over 100 mm of penetration at 0º if I’m not mistaken, it’s a massive improvement in anti-tank ability compared to what they can do now.

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I guess.

But it should be a valid reason.

Most of the time it doesn’t even make sense. Just Gaijin doing stupid things.

If they do it, it will probably be in a 1/3 ratio with HE or something like that.

Which I disagree as well. Players should be able to choose what kind of belts they want.
For balance reasons it makes way more sense to limit AP shell for SPAA anyway.

Why should a SPAA ever go to battle with 100% AP ammo?

30mm MK-103 HVAP use to have 95mm which is historically accurate since these guns use to have up to 100mm of pen

No SPAA should have AP belts, it’s a net negative for game balance and always leads to SPAA getting over-tiered in regards to their actual AA capability. See the Falcon sitting at 8.0 with no radar or the ZSU-57 at 7.0 despite it’s poor fire rate and accuracy.

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I thought the same. When I play Wirbelwind, Ostwind, Ostwind II it is already almost likie that. Even your AP shells just have around 50mm pen at 0m/0deg, which is not enough to kill anything more than unarmored light tanks/vehicles. A Sherman can be probably penned through the lower side at PB range, but thats it…you can’t kill most of the tanks you encounter. The Kugelblitz at 7.X with 75mm pen or something is the first German SPAA which is able to pen at least medium tanks at their sides.

While other nations get 70mm…80mm…even more pen at much, much lower BRs. They can play their SPAA’s totally different and use it quite successfully to counter tanks. Even take on enemy heavy tanks from the side. Dunno why so many think this is fair or balanced. When a SPAA has 70mm pen, or 80…why isn’t it at 7.0 or 7.3 BR as Kugel is?


I say limited AP rounds. It doesn’t make sense for them to have no AP round but it also doesn’t make sense for them to have mostly AP rounds and play TD.


It is, the solution to one SPAA being broken is not to break all the other SPAAs too.

But I still understand the frustration that this is coming from. The USSR gets the Praga at 6.3 after all, which can very easily kill heavies even, and frontally, it basically needs to just cursorily glance at your barrel for it to spontaneously detonate. Even if you’re just focusing on pure anti air, you will end up in situations in an SPAA where you need to defend yourself against a land threat, and there, the disparity between German and some other AA is a little… annoying.

They’re very good against planes though. I’m not one of them, but I’ve seen what really good players can do in an Ostwind II.