Funny enough ROMOR-A might get buffed
So the ERA on the Challenger mk3 would have better protection then the Challenger 2 TES if it happens
https://community.gaijin.net/issues/p/warthunder/i/RDpEDW9EHG3n
Gaijin? Making something Western actually well protected? Naaah man. Here, take this AGM-65G as consolidation prize though.
Even with better armor, they would have a worse reload, mobility, no blowouts, not survivable unless they make charges not that sensible. Imho they could lower the reload of the Challenger 2 to 4 seconcs for the ready rack of 4 rounds, and the rest to 5.5 seconds, so they could be better at something atleast.
Challenger 3 is in a weird spot, which shouldn’t be surprising since its a TD.
It is a very nich maverick love domeing T90s
It doesn’t get thing the real one would have like spall liners in the turret and blow out panels
The penetration difference between A1 and F1 is 14mm at 60, that is as close together as you can get my guy, 14mm is not going to let you penetrate anything new or impressive.
I agree with this, but your original statement was that the M256 armed M1s have a superior reload which is false, and the hull issues on both vehicles is well known.
All 2AX series tanks in the German tree have spall liners, this by default makes them superior to their spall linerless counterparts among a myriad of other reasons as to why the 2AX series preforms well.
In the case of Sweden its just the 2AX series’s strengths cranked up to 11, it should be self explanatory why that is a powerful reality.
Nice try the M1A2 came into service 3 years before the first 2A5 rolled off the production line, and Gaijin had no wishes to actually give anyone a DM53 equivalent while the 2AX series was dominating everyone.
If by good you mean sit around 50 to 55% WR with everyone else, I did not know good was blatantly average or meh.
My dude called a steel man designed argument a strawman, top kek you flat out fell for my bait.
Let me just,
Oh would you look at that, the table has more than one row, and what is that? A lot of nations suffering at the same time?
Heavens forbid a generalized downturn occurs, this is impossible and must be the work of the AIM as you said, because otherwise the US should not be suffering.
Cool, don’t care, global WRs are global WRs, I kick ass in the M6A2E1, it does not make it a god tier vehicle.
If you are taking hits as a sniper you are doing it wrong, you need a capable gun and a good FCS, both of which the Type 10 has over it’s competition with gen 3 thermals, 4x-13.3x mag, and a 4 second reload.
By comparison the Sep V2 has gen 2 thermals, 3x-10x mag and a 5 second reload.
So nope.
Penetrable frontal volume against 3BM42 is extremely similar between the SEPV2 and Azur, both die to a front pen without issue, the M1 has no mythical, quoted survivability which gets passed around so often, F1 is a M829A1 equivalent, the second best round fielded by the US, I concur it is not equal to M829A2, yet it is a 11.3 round, it is not the best top tier round but not even remotly the worse.
In the case of fuel tank explosions, write that issue down for any tank with non-external fuel tanks, this is not a uncommon fact.
Oh no the F-16C exists and is a actual usable CAS bird for the US at top tier, I sure do hope for the past two years a group of other aircraft and equipment have not been decimating the playing field and still make me largely irrelevant.
Would you prefer I compare it to a tree nobody cares about instead? How about DTC10, its retains the same 10mm+ better penetration and is China’s only top tier round, or how about slpprj m/95 which is less than 10mm away from F1, or how about M338 ad M322, both of which still retain a difference of about 10 to 15mm at 60.
Wow, would you look at that, it turns out that F1 is a pretty average top tier round, yet pales when compared to the likes of DM53, Type 10, or A2, all of which produce far higher values.
I’m sure the variance of 10 to 20mm of pen causes massive differences in capabilities between the average rounds. (Spoiler alert, it does not)
They don’t
Reload shouldn’t be a balance factor, in fact, you can’t possibly tell me than a two piece ammunition is somehow faster to reload than a standard 980mm cartrigde on the turret.
Unfortunately for british mains, the Challenger 2 is a crappy design that went too far. Just downtier them (to 10.7-11.0) and be done with it.
You know the mig27 is one of the worst top tier cas planes right
Now your gone too far
The were made for hull down engaments their whole mantlet is wrong
Not a crappy design
So were the Merkavas, Leopards and Abrams; neither of these tank have the survivability flaws that the British MOD didn’t care to address on…25 years?
What flaws like what are you on about
They do, the 2A4 and PL do not fall under the blanket of 2AX, I’ve already mentioned that this refers to everything past the 2A5, which makes a total of 4 vehicles with such protection.
I use this similar format when speaking about the M1 series, with the series indicating all M1 derived vehicles and M1AX referring to everything post the M1A1.
No I am not falling for that gaslighting.
Im not wrong though a even the Indian jag is better for CAS
Yes, you’re although forgetting about the fact OFL 120 F1 as i said is LKE1, which is DM43, it does have more penetration only because its fired from an L52, and it still retains the terrible spalling, you can except from an 11.3 round at best.
Additionally, im not sure why you’re comparing M829A1 where the Leclercs are 11.7, and top tier Abrams have all M829A2, but im going to give you that.
My statement was about the M256 armed M1’s have better reload than Leopards, which is true, not sure where you picked up i was talking about the Leclerc here.
Only tank with full coverage on spall liners is the 2A7V, spall liners in the turret may help if you’re getting penetrated by the sides, you cannot penetrated the arrow wedges anyway.
As i said, Spall Liners are truly an issue on Sweden, because of the tank it does have, and again, turret spall liners are not that strong, given you cannot penetrate the turret anyway, if the Leopard turret cheeks could be penetrated i’d give you that, but it doesn’t.
55% WR is a respectful win rate, it means that they’re quite much equivalent to other nations, what is the issue here?
Not sure why you’re taking 3BM42, but the SEP is frontally immune to every APFSDS on the turret cheeks.
Again, its not, its DM43, which is an 11.3 round that you can find on the 2PL, it is not a top tier worthy round by any means, it does have an acceptable penetration because its fired from an L52, while the spalling is still bad.
Also, compare 11.7 Leclerc round with 11.7 Abrams round, why you’re comparing a worse round?
Find it quite funny that you’re all comparing all of them to the 60 degree compartment.
M338, M322 are both better rounds than OFL 120 F1 by far, and DTC10 is better as well, even if we do not count penetration the spalling is better.
By any change you have tried OFL 120 F1? Or M322/M338 by any chance? Or you’re putting words withot proof?
As you can see, unlike a certain person, you don’t seem to have much experience at top tier, so what are you speaking for?
Its not the worst, but its not the best anymore, only Germany have consistently worse CAS here.
Yeah no this is bait or you have been living under a rock for the past 2 years.
60 degree penetration is all that matters when comparing APFSDS-T, flat penetration is irrelevant in the grand scheme of things.
Yes I have spent a long with with M332 and K-EW, I find both darts to be largely identical to 829A1spall wise, with the M332 having a bit more overall spall due to it’s increased projectile mass.
In my time messing around the F1 on dev, it’s performance very much so reminded me of K-EW the most.
Its not bait a mig23 with a bigger gun and no thermals isn’t gonna do well at top tier
You should of shown the new su25
Living under a rock then, got it.
Oh hey, only took like, what? 5 Posts to get to the stat shaming, nice.
A round that i would love to see in my tree at some point with the Al Husein as its got better pen then L27
Mig27 was really good when it came out
But time has passed