Penetration only matters at a certain point, you should know this out of all people. And no matter how good something penetrates something else, the thing which carries said gun is the most impactful factor, and in this case it’s the godawful M60.
Put as much lipstick onto that ogre and it ain’t getting any prettier, the M60 is overly outmatched at this BR and especially by the FV4030/3.
Leopard 2K is the fastest MBT in the game before Type 90
This is blatantly wrong, the ZTZ99A, WZ1001, the Leclerc and the XM-1 (C) are all faster than the Leopard 2K (and there is probably even more). The Leopard 2K also has significantly worse survivability and protection than the FV4030/3 and not to mention a much worse reload and FCS.
No, the top speed for the said vehicles I’ve mentioned are indeed superior to the Leopard 2K, you yourself even said speed, not acceleration/time to target. Maybe next time make a clear distinguishment so something like this doesn’t happen again lmao.
My point still stand as all vehicles I mentioned are still faster than the Leopard 2K
How does this warrant the FV4030/3 to be 1 BR step lower than the Leopard 2K though? How does this make the Leopard 2K undoubtably superior to the FV4030/3 either way?
I knew it was going to be insane for 9.7 lmao, most people thought it was going to be pretty mid for 9.7 but oh how things have came out.
With or without buffs, it NEEDS to move up to 10.0 at the very least, 10.3 might be pushing it since it would basically be just a worse Challenger Mk.2.
“With or without buffs, it needs to move up to 10.0 at the very least”
I like how you are not okay with it getting downtiers to 8.7 but are somehow okay with it being pushed to 10.0 to where it can face tanks such as the chinese premium Al Khalid.
I personally think its in the right BR. If anything UK doesn’t have any 9.7’s backups from the tech tree, so you are either using it on your 10.0/10.3 lineup as a backup or using the UK 9.3’s lineup as backup risking a potential uptier to 10.7. How is this somehow overpowered? If anything its a gamble whether you’re in for a downtier, or an uptier.
I like how you are not okay with it getting downtiers to 8.7 but are somehow okay with it being pushed to 10.0 to where it can face tanks such as the chinese premium Al Khalid
The Chinese Al-Khalid-I needs to be moved up within itself, it has no right being 11.0 lmao. Don’t use broken vehicles as an example, and when in a full uptier expect the vehicle to obviously perform badly lol.
You’re right, the Al-Khalid could probably go up to 11.3 and be just fine alongside the Fuji, Raam Sagol, etc.
However, let me stop you right there and use the uno reverse card on your logic.
When in a full down tier expect the vehicle to obviously outperform the underdogs? If its a 9.7 and gets downtiered to 8.7 should it not outperform the 8.7 vehicles in some way? Given its a “Challenger prototype” its playstyle is obviously hull down, sniping vehicles from afar. So you would play it as you play a Chieftain, or a Challenger. If you decide to play it on open terrain then you can easily be pen and killed. How is it problematic?
As I’ve said above, it performs well in downtiers, probably won’t perform as well in a full uptier to 10.7, and definitely doesn’t need to be raised to 10.0, much less 10.3.
You do realise that the FV4030/3 has better protection than the Challenger Mk.2 which sits at 10.3? The only real impactful difference is the usage of L23A1 on the Mk.2 and thermals, other than that they’re the exact same.
Does the Mk.2 need to move down since it “can’t” perform well against 11.3 vehicles? No, stop coping, this thing is entirely broken at 9.7 and needs to be moved up to 10.0 and receive L23A1 as compensation.
People are gonna be complaining hard about chobham armour for a while because of the shirt 2 event. Even tho I’ve only hade the composite armour save me a handful of times so far, there’s loads of darts at that BR which go clean through it btw
I was under the impression they were essentially identical. The same armour protection, mobility, etc (of course not including any protection the dozer blade provides on the Mk2. I think it provides additional protection anyway)
Its a Challenger Mk2 without TVD and with a weaker shell, which is why it sits lower. I also dont overly consider the Mk2 all that strong of a 10.3. 10.3 worthy certainly, but there are certainly stronger 10.3s.
9.7 doesnt entirely seem unreasonable for it considering the compression.
Given L23A1 it could be moved to 10.0 and would probably be overall healthier for it as there is an actual line-up at 10.0. But I think that should be the reason for it moving and not because its OP vs 8.7s.
What?? Welcome to literally EVERY tank in the game, it’s round is PLENTY sufficient! M1 and Leo 2A4 only have 370/408 pen and face 11.7… the tank still performs extremely well in 10.3 battles. Saying it needs to stay at 9.7 is actually insane
Don’t know about this one, the current MBTs at 9.7 is incredibly strong, T-64BV and Sabra has firepower advantage over it except for reload, but I can see the turret armor and mobility of the Shir is too much when played properly. But I hadn’t played it yet, and I noticed that the frequency of downtier in this br also much higher than 9.3.
Not every tank should be JUDGED on the same aspects, thats what most players lack awareness in top tier, some are extremely mobile, others pack a good punch, some can do it all without being particular best in any.
The M1 Abrams and the Leo 2A4 have insane mobility in both forward and reversal which makes them a very solid MBT for their BR. Its not about their gun penetration but how you use the mobility to your advantage to secure forwarded positions and tear down enemy teams, secure a good position and your gun will do the rest.
Challengers do not have good mobility compared to other MBT’s at 10.3 or 10.7, therefore they are not tanks to secure forwarded positions but instead play the support role and snipe enemies from afar. If a Challenger player somehow decides to go forward and play out of cover which is entirely possible they’re not using their tank strengths for their advantage rather instead their insticts and skills as a player.
The FV4030/3 is no exception to this, while it sits at 9.7 with a SOLID ROUND for its BR it is in no way in need of a NERF to a higher battle rating. As it is it can get to see the 10.7’s anyway if unlucky to a full up tier. PLUS as I’ve said before the UK doesn’t really have a SOLID lineup to go with it anyway, all backups are 9.3 vehicles besides the one premium Roolkat at 9.7.
