F2H-4 Banshee: The Big Boxy Banjo

Would you like to see the F2H-4 in-game?
  • Yes
  • No
0 voters

F2H-4 Banshee

F2H-4 Banshee: The Last Banshee

This is a suggestion post for the F2H-4 Banshee, the final variant of the Banshee family. No previous suggestions have been made for this plane, except for its very similar earlier iteration, the F2H-3:

I. FH Phantom and F2H-2 Banshee
During the height of the Pacific War, while Grumman and Vaught pumped out aircraft by the thousands daily to fuel the war effort, McDonnell, a small and totally unknown design bureau by comparison, bid its time to design the jet-powered replacements of the piston-engined mainstays of the US Navy. This work would culminate in the FH Phantom, a modest and easygoing compact twin-engined fighter jet, which proved the viability of jet-powered carrier aviation. While not an imposing fighter on its own, it proved to be an important first step, leading to its successor, the bigger, and meaner, F2H Banshee. The jet proved a successful design, a flexible, long-ranged and hard hitting middle-weight fighter - until outclassed by the sudden appearance of the Soviet swept wing MiG-15 fighter.

F2H-2 Banshee

II. The Bigger, Boxier Banshee
With the realization that straight-wing jet fighters were immediately outclassed by the MiG-15 and F-86 Sabre, aircraft designs had to be completely re-adapted or remade from scratch to keep up with the times. However, this process takes time, and while designs like the F3H Demon were on the drawing board, an interim solution had to be drawn up to give the carrier groups a fighting chance. McDonnell decided the best course of action would be to improve upon the F2H-2’s pre-existing strengths, such as its long range, high-altitude performance, and mission flexibility, and incorporate features from the successful trial of the experimental, radar-equipped F2H-2N. Combined, this resulted in the bigger, boxy F2H-3 and F2H-4.

F2H-3 Banshee

III. The F2H-4 Banshee
The F2H-3 proved to be the best short-term package for the mission of all-weather carrier defender and strike fighter, combining stable and agile straight-wing flight performance, high-altitude capability, a search and track radar (AN/APQ-41) substantially superior to the old APS-19 set used on the F2H-2N, and a bigger, more robust airframe capable of carrying more weapons, and better weapons at that. The F2H-3 would serve both the US Navy, as well as successfully be exported to the Royal Canadian Navy. Marginal improvements to the success of the F2H-3 led to its final iteration, the F2H-4. The F2H-4 would come equipped with the further improved AN/APG-37 radar, which would later be seen on the Sabredogs, and the most powerful pair of engines on the Banshee. In all, the F2H-4 would serve the US Navy and Marine Corps from 1953, after the Korean War, until its retirement in 1961, as the final straight-wing fighter jet. In 1962, the type, now in storage, would be redesignated F-2D.

F2H-3 Banshee

IV. F2H-4 Banshee Statistics
F2H-4 stats will be put up next to the F2H-2’s stats for comparison

F2H-2 F2H-4
Length 40’ 2" 48’ 2"
Wingspan 41’ 9" 41’ 9"
Height 14’ 6" 14’ 6"
Empty Weight 11,146 lbs 13,183 lbs
Gross Weight 20,555 lbs 28,500 lbs
Engines (×2) J-34-WE-34 J-34-WE-38
Total Thrust 6,500 lbf 7,200 lbf
Top Speed 575 mph 610 mph
Service Ceiling 48,500 ft 56,000 ft
Max. Range 1,475 mi 1,716 mi
Radar AN/APG-30 AN/APG-37
Radar Type Rangefinder Search/Track
Tip Tanks 200 gal (×2) 170 gal (×2)
Bomb Capacity 1,000 lbs 2,000 lbs
Rockets ×8 HVAR ×8 HVAR
Cannons ×4 M3 20 mm ×4 Mk.12 20 mm
Ammo Pool 600 rounds 940 rounds ᵃ
Missiles N/A ×2 AIM-9B ᵇ

a) 250 rpg were carried on the lower pair of cannons, while 220 rpg were carried on the upper pair of cannons.

b) AIM-9B’s were tested on the F2H-3 and -4 by the USN, which retained the wiring and wingtip pylons for it as in the picture above. However, only the RCN routinely operated F2H-3’s loaded with AIM-9B’s for missions

USN also operated the AIM-9B on their F2H-3/-4:

F2H-3 with Missiles

Should the F2H-4 get a pair of AIM-9B?
  • Yes
  • No
0 voters

V. F2H-4’s place in War Thunder
The F2H-4 would be positioned at Rank V, of the tech tree, foldered underneath its predecessor, the F2H-2, on the US naval aviation line. Its battle rating would most likely be 7.7, or 8.0, depending on if its given a pair of AIM-9B Sidewinders. The addition of the missiles would make the F2H-4 the only tech tree equivalent to the uncommon premium Sea Hawk Mk.100, as Rank V straight-wing jets with early missiles. Without the missiles, the uprated jet engines, more powerful radar and improved cannons still justify a slightly higher BR of 7.7 versus the F2H-2’s 7.3.

VI. Citations

2 Likes

+1 from me, we need more inter-Korea/Vietnam war planes!

(I am still very sad that only the F3H-2, A-4B, and F-9J managed to end up as TT, rather than also having the Skyray, Tiger, and more of these there as well

1 Like

Big +1

1 Like

I guess F2H-4 would be 8.3 BR same F9F-8 Cougar

+1

AIM-9Bs weren’t just tested by the US, they were used in service on their F2H-3 and 4:

Spoiler

China Lake testing on F2H-2

Service use with VAW-11


6 Likes

No, the Cougar carries double the missiles and is swept wing, it is markedly superior to the F2H-4. I suggested 8.0 would be enough, given the game already has a similar plane in game: Sea Hawk Mk.100

I assumed the internal mounting of the AIM-9B’s was only experimental, did not know they actually served like this, given the whole problem of rocket-smoke ingestion for the engines. Since that doesn’t matter in-game, I figure it would simply be up to the devs to mount the missiles inwards or outwards. Thanks for the additional pictures.

2 Likes

I’m not sure F2H-4 place to rank V or rank VI. but located between F2H-2 & F9F or in the folder with F9F Panther and F9F-8 Cougar ?

F2H-4 would be 8.0 BR same Sea Hawk Mk.100 ?

F2H-2 is already in rank V, BR 7.3. Therefore its logical the F2H-4 would be foldered with the -2, in rank V, at BR 8.0, not foldered with the F9F. This is the same BR as the Sea Hawk Mk.100, which is a comparable plane.

1 Like

You guess F2H-4 place between F2H-2 and F9F group or after F9F group (F9F Panther & F9F-8 Cougar)

+1, we need more early jets in my opinion, especially ones with radar so the learning curve isn’t as steep.

Spoiler

2 Likes

+1 This would be a great addition. The F2H-2 rocks. A radar and some AIM-9s would be nice. Also lots of great skins to choose from including experimental natural metal.

1 Like

Honestly I think that if it gets AIM-9s it’d be best as a premium, both to better match the Sea Hawks and also because AIM-9s weren’t used operationally. Perhaps another model, like the F2H-3, could be tech tree? Or as a last alternative copy-paste into the TT without Sidewinders, and just have an arbitrary naming difference between the models, maybe like the F-2D.

3 Likes

I could agree with the F2H-4 as a premium. The F2H-3 could be a tech tree add in the silver experimental finish the Navy tried out in the early-mid 50s.

Then you could do a Sidewinder capable F2H-4 in the late career gull grey over white as premium.

However the performance of the two is not all that different so the difference of the premium jet would be a different paint scheme and a crappy AIM-9B?

I’d much rather just have an early, silver F2H-3 with no Winders. Would fit the BR level better. I like the tank/no tank option like on the -2 currently in the game as well.

Sidewinders were used operationally by U.S. big Banshees. VF-52 and VAW-11 (yes they had a det) both used them in the late 50s on the last couple cruises.

2 Likes

I like the idea of of having two separate aircraft, one with missiles one without. Maybe as you said, F2H-3 or “F2H-4 early” in the TT with no missiles, and then a premium F2H-4 (or F-2D if we use its 1962 redesignation) with missiles. Only reason I didn’t mention it is bc suggestions have to be about one aircraft only

I’ll add this to the suggestion post, ty

The AIM-9B was not limited to the F2H-4, the F2H-3 had it too. I also would not mark with the post 62 naming system. It was never called an F-2D in an active duty fleet squadron.

Truly think that we could ditch the two jet concept and stick with one. The differences are almost a non-issue. F2H-3 or -4. To make it easy, just ask for one.

It could come standard in the experimental natural metal, with a gull gray over white unlockable skin to represent the later jets. The Sidewinder could be added too as both variants carried it.

Side note, yes some big banshees had the overall glossy sea blue but these were only the initial early deliveries. The rest were natural metal.

Here’s what I want as the base skin:

Overall natural metal, with black radome and OD green anti-glare between cockpit and radome. Simple and a good representation of the jet for the first half of its active duty service life. If they add this, I’d be very content.

1 Like

But personally, might be F2H-3 with AIM-9B for regular pack rank V

F2H-3 (early) for researchable tree because none AIM-9B

I suppose in the folder with F2H-2