I hope we get the same on the German Tornados with the ARMIGER, just HARM would suck but would be understandable
I don’t believe it was ever fully integrated, so I doubt it irl.
But i’d be surprised if the radar can’t do this on its own? Also you have the RWR for a reason, which can give estimated locations and engagement zones for SAM’s.
Although on the other hand of things I suspect brimstone/spear are actually superior against modern air defenses by pure numbers. Having 12 missiles coming at you is a hell of a lot more difficult to handle than 2-6, even if they are slower.
I think they’d be making a mistake to deny us ALARM, there’s other, more dubious missiles in-game. It’s simply an integrations issue. It fits on the pylon, its standard with tornado. I don’t think they’d be doing something advantageous to the game to deny it for EFT.
You’d get more ALARM’s on Tornado than EFT, but less Brimstones, so they may deem it a balancing measure just to give it to Tornado.
Not really as you multilayer SAM batteries. Patriots are setup with C-RAM
S-400/500 should have Pantsirs
Its difficult to compare given the era these weapons operated.
ALARM was 1990 to 2013/2014. So a Tornado GR1 firing off 9x ALARM is a lot of SEAD. Brimstone 1s werent until 2005 and meant more for dealing with Convoys. By the time Brimstone 2s entered service in 2015 and probably better suited for SEAD, the ALARM was already retired and a replacement wasnt thought about probably due to having Brimstone 2s
Yes but that’s partially my point. As SAMs get more modern, sheer numbers matter over anything else. Being able to send 12 missiles per aircraft to just saturate an IADS will matter much more than the individual missile’s performance.
Would there be less?
By my count, its 2 ALARM + 12 Brimstones on the Typhoon vs 4 ALARM + 18x Brimstones or 6x ALARM + 12 Brimstones on the GR4
I thought, there would be less, but perhaps not.
For every ALARM you carry on the EFT you lose three Brimstones. On the Tornado you can carry four ALARMs before losing any Brimstones, that more than offsets the three fewer Brimstones you can carry to start with.
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Spoiler
Depends on whether you want AAMs or Fuel tanks / Trading Brimstoens for ALARM on the Wing pylons
Aerodynamic heating can differ between blunt body penetrators (like the IR seeker), and sharp penetrators like the CAMM.
But yeah, purely from a deltaV standpoint it’s a bit weird that CAMM doesn’t just reach about Mach 5 if you use it for calculating the requirements of ASRAAM.
It would be nice for gaijin to one day better represent drag, especially at above Mach 1.5 for both planes and munitions.
And there is another factor, that ARM vs Radar is an ongoing technology war, with each new thing in their respective cathergory bringing something new.
I agree and US have developed MALD for this purpose but ultimately Brimstone is slow and short range.
I don’t think it could ever reliably be a DEAD weapon.
SPEAR perhaps but with modern SAMS speed is as important as numbers.
MBDA state ASRAAM experiences more than 1,000°C of aerodynamic heating compared to about 600°C for Meteor. I found a research paper on the aerodynamic heating of missiles, it is a bit dated (1955) but it appeared to show that you would need to be going at over Mach 5 to have any real chance of reaching 1,000°C of aero heating, the rate at which heat is radiated off the body of the missile into the surrounding atmosphere makes it very hard to achieve that level of aero heating without extreme speeds.
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I agree more with @Metaltank1990 on this point. Brimstone, for example, range aside is still a decently fast and small target, so it’s harder to deal with it using anything else but surface to air missile. And if you manage to get 2-3 planes with a dozen or so of these armements on a specific area, there’s currently no air defense in the world that would not be saturated.
Now, brimstone is still short range as you said, but the same logic applies to longer range weapons, hence the range of new small glide bombs proposed recently, from the standard GPS to even proposal of multi seeker systems
I suspect SPEAR 3 might be doing this.
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My classes on hypersonic and aerodynamic heating are a bit rusty, but you also have to consider that rounded body like an IR seeker experience hotter concentrated hotspots while a more streamlined seeker will have the heat radiate a larger area with lower temperature.
From your paper from 1955, it’s more likely that this was probably considering radar seekers since long range IR just wasn’t a thing. Now, probably doesn’t account for the 400ºC difference between meteor and ASRAAM, so the later is most likely faster in peak speed
Ages ago, I could have sworn I read something somewhere about an ARM version of the Spear, but its just as possible I miss-read it or am just miss-remembering it
Also they appeared to be referring to heating experienced by the skin of the rocket motor case, so the shape of the missile’s nose likely has limited impact on that.
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