Would it be possible to share the methodology used by the devs to calculate the cap weight ?
Since no one seems to have the documentation at hand, shouldn’t the final pen be based on the most solid estimation ? Not saying the dev one is incorrect, but we can’t really conclude on anything if no comparison is possible.
Yeah somehow you easly ammorack the dunkerque ( at least on the balistic test ) at some weird spot. Like im not 100% sure but it seems that the blast effect is just ignoring the 50 mm plate behind the belt and the angled 40 mm plate
well if you get closer you can just punch trough the citadel front because theres no armor plate near the bow that would set the fuze for the shell. So this might aswell be the easiest bb to snipe citadel
Not to mention that this is for 305mm ww1 apc, so everything else will have an absolute fieldday and treat this essentially the same as a hipper
Meawhile IRL it was suposed to be able to resist shell from the germans 283 mm gun ( graf spee and the schanhorst ) .
Not to mention that it was used in the atlantic to hunt the scharnhorst with the hood and with the actual shell that we have in the game i doubt it could even scratch him …
Without forgeting that the engaging range in the game is way too close compared to irl ( betwen 15 and 30 km )
I tested it out with a friend that had enough spare GE to unlock her and my conclusion is that one of the biggest problems with Dunkerque’s layout is how easily the front shell room explodes. Magazine detonations don’t happen as often as the shell room tends to absorb the shells coming in from the bow when you’re angled. That’s a good thing in the sense that you won’t get detonated and die right away. But it’s really bad given that current shell room mechanics remove all ammo upon detonation and you are going to have only half your firepower serviceable most of the time.
You’re assuming that the devs even have half an understanding of history. It is pretty easy to tell that with engagement ranges and intended targets the round is underperforming. But this was my concern seeing it advertised as coming, the armour wouldn’t be adequate for the short ranges they’d allow the guns to be effective at.
Really hate when I’m correct about how poorly they treat minor nation kit. At this rate, we’ll get a KGV made of tissue paper and barely able to engage things at 5km
yeah but whats i also find weird is that if the shot are from the side at let’s say 15 km and is hitting the belt at the level of the magazine the shell will pen the belt then either be blocked by the 40 mm angled plate or explode after that plate BUT the explosion is somehow damaging enought the magazine to be either yellow or light red/ dark red
it really feels like the shell explode against the 50 mm plate and the shrapnel and the blast make his way throught that . so maybe its the armor penetration by HE action doing that since the shell im testing with have 64 mm of pen when exploding
same test with the scharnhorst shell
so update it’s seems that i was right and that mean the 50 mm thick plate behind is totaly useless even against 283mm shell … what is surprising me tho is that the shrapnel is complitly destroying the magazine and the 50 mm thick plate seems to not even reduce the damage from the blast
Hi Frenchtank, I’m the friend that Bofors mentioned. After much testing with Dunkerque - my thoughts are that this thing is extremely poor indeed. This thing in game is more equivalent to either the Graf Spee or even HMS Glorious, the hull is so weak that it feels like a cruiser hull - Bofors recorded a couple examples during our test.
Even the Graf Spee’s weaker 11in guns were able to cleave right through the angled bow and destroy the shell room - permanently disabling no.1 turret. Forget even trying to fight a Scharnhorst that has more penetration and a faster rate of fire…
The guns feel incredibly anemic, I was barely able to scratch anything at 10km or more due to the poor penetration and the awful vertical dispersion (I can be aiming waterline and half my salvo lands short and the other half hits the spotting top)
Even at 6.7 this thing feels weak, the weak cruiser like hull and poor guns just make this thing feel awful. The fact that the guns reload at the same pace as the Japanese 14in and the British 15in guns while being more anemic than many 12in options is laughably sad.
Its true that the dispersion and the shell pen is what make me the most sick about it
Fun fact: The 330mm actually has roughly average dispersion, of only 0.25 x 0.39. Combined with a high muzzle velocity and a low drag it’s about the same or better many guns in her BR (e.g. those of USS Texas/Nevada, British 13.5 inch (e.g. from Queen Mary)). And a fun fact here: it’s more accurate than the Japanese 36 cm/45 Type 41.
See: User:Jareel_Skaj/Navy Shells - War Thunder Wiki
You guys are now just running on a confirmation bias against these guns, lol
Don’t get me wrong, they are crippled by the sub-pair penetration, but the accuracy really isn’t the issue here. (In before: Yes, I did play my fair share with Dunkerque on the dev server, just like I did play with Caracciolo)
If the guns were actually good I could accept it having a cruiser hull but it’s just not the case. Honestly the survivability is what bums me out the most, angling is just a farse in this thing because the nose is so incredibly weak. Having your shell room blown and becoming a 4 gun battleship is almost a fate worst than just blowing up outright.
From my testing, the dispersion feels a lot worse than those mentioned - the horizontal spread isn’t too bad but the vertical dispersion feels especially bad. Admiral Bofors can attest to this.
Don’t know what to tell you. I played as well, got very different impressions, and I can tell you that my experience is matching the data from the in-game files.
🤷♂️
but yeah in final the shell pen is still a big issues i mean even the scharnhorst that have less bigger gun have a shell that weight 2 times less than the dunkerque one and have the same velocity have still better pen
so idk what to say or to do for gaijin to change that
Fair enough, by far the largest issue of this thing is the poor survivability which is something I think all of us can agree on. The only way I can see it being improved is if Gaijin decides to rework how shell rooms work which I don’t think is ever going to happen.
or add the strasbourg and make the boat have the same engaging range as IRL like 15 km 30 km minimum
While Strasbourg would somewhat rectify some of the protection issues, it would still suffer from the weak nose and the lackluster shells. Also the fact that it took Gaijin this long to add Dunkerque at all doesn’t give me high hopes…
At least we would get a backup for a lineup if we do end up getting her.
I mean making a ship maybe take some time but since it’s a copy paste with a different belt thickness we can hope a bit .
so maybe they will add it as a premium (i really hope not ) or they will add it like the other in something like 1 or 2 updates just like they did with the premium sister ships
Gaijin monkey paw curls, Strasbourg is to be added as the reward for a Naval tournament with a hard limit of 10k ships distributed total.
Yeah do not put it past them to add the better sister/version as an event. Thats what happened with Renown and Repulse.
