Yes the project exists officially. What does not exist official are the specs and requirements.
That is the entire point of the article, it makes an educated GUESS. It also is entirely possible that the BMVg stays with L55A1 to keep costs down as non sensible this would be.
So again no official requirement just educated guesses by a media outlet.
Leopard 3 again remains a private venture by Rheinmetall
The dichotomy of forum users.
So again no official requirement just educated guesses by a media outlet.
Sure, we can look at it from such an angle too, but we can also look at Pistorius’ statements and conclude early that they have already decided, and MGCS will likely produce two variants - one with a German gun (for Germany) and one with a French gun (for France, duh).
Though I reckon armament will be interchangeable since both turret will have to comply with the hull’s requirements & design parameters… that are wholey in Germany’s hands.
No German player wants Challenger. It’s a mediocre tank, in game and in reality. There is only one thing that makes this particular Challenger worthwhile, and that’s its gun, which just so happens to be designed, built and tested by Germany. If you guys are really clamouring for these scraps of German tech then maybe you are playing the wrong tech tree…
Again, I don’t think anybody here is trying to claim a german tank for the british tech tree.
So far we have ordered 18 2A8 to be delivered in 2026.
In a 2020 interview with Frank Lobitz they spoke about requirements which would be whished for like RWS, Hardkill APS, new engine and FCS. But again nothing about it required to have a 130mm main gun.
But the actual official requirements for the Brückenlösung aka 2AX/ 3/ whatever are likely not to be decided on until 2026.
https://www.hartpunkt.de/vom-leopard-2-a8-zum-mgcs-bundeswehr-plant-mit-brueckenloesung/
You do hopefully now understand:
(Ironically same situation as with the KF41 Lynx in game where the KF51 if it comes should go to Hungary since they have officially ordered the further development of it. And guess what it won’t come with the 130mm but the L55A1 120mm
)
So if we now take everything together: there is no official requirement for a tank with the 130mm Rheinmetall L/51 at this point in time. And also no tank ordered with this gun from Germany for the Bundeswehr.
At this point just go to a leopard thread
Not the case. These cannons are being developed for MGCS specifically.
Säule 2 – Kanone, Turm und Munition unter deutsch-französischer Führung. In einem ersten Schritt sollen jeweils national unterschiedliche Kanonensysteme entwickelt und nach einer Vergleichserprobung ein System ausgewählt werden.
https://defence-network.com/der-neue-kampfpanzer-mgcs-nach-boxer-muster/
Not what this says.
These cannons are considered for MGCS, not developed for it. Again a big difference.
Ahh, I must have missed the part where Britain is considering the 130 mm…
Just to make it clear, neither UK nor Germany goes for 130. The Cr2 130 was a private venture of Rheinmetall, where they presented that 130 autoloader they did worked. Purpose of the video was 130 with its autoloading presentation for potential buyers in the future, neither of countries wanted to buy it.
Did I claim somewhere it did?
The simple matter of fact is that is Rheinmetall we’re the one ones that used a challenger 2 (not a Leopard chassis in case you forgot) chassis to make a sales pitch demonstrator for their product.
This his nothing to do with either country
Please just go to a different thread, this one is about the Cr2…
So Rheinmetall, a German company, puts forward its gun the 130 mm L/51 to meet a requirement of the Franco-German MGCS which requires the development of a new gun… and somehow it has nothing to do with Germany?
I was happy to leave it alone but Warhead brought it up again…
Yeah well you came back to argue just the same, it takes two to tango.
All somebody has to do is make a new thread and link the previous message here
No Rheinmetall pitches a new 130mm gun in the hopes that the MGCS program which hasn’t decided on armament yet chooses it. Private company tries to sell gun to joint Anglo french project. Which does not mean Germany developed it or Germany ordered it which you two have been trying to claim.
Britain wasn’t considering the RH120L55A1 either when Rheinmetall remodelled the turret.
The proposal for a new turret, the 130mm, and smoothbore 120mm were all initiatives by Rheinmetall outside the scope of CR2LEP funding. In terms of history, the UK MoD preferring Rheinmetall’s proposal for the smoothbore 120mm and not the 130mm is the only difference between the 130mm CR2 and the CR3TD we have in game - it’s the same hull, the same Thales UK DGNS T3 and Orion sight complexes that originated in the CR2LEP bid and represents Rheinmetall’s vehicle, not the UK MoD’s Challenger 3 prototypes.
Officially, at least…
https://x.com/Leopard24theWin/status/1793726280099312047
You do hopefully now understand:
Is it a norm nowdays to just ignore when people point out contradictions in other’s arguments?
- This gap filler however at its current state has no official requirements, with the requirements not expected to release until 2026
KMW thinks prototypes will be built in 2025 with serial production beginning in 2026/8 (tbh the image is of bad quality).
Minor correction: The Orion sights are French and pre-date the CR2 LEP. They were never specifically designed for the LEP just the best option the French wanted to offer the British. So the Orion sights being on the CR2 130mm is pretty meaningless.
Last I checked Rheinmetall is a German company and has been for over a century. Vehicles can either be added based on their use by a nation’s military or by its country of construction, it has been this way since the game released.
Britain has considered the 120 mm for the Challenger in the past via CLIP, and if they weren’t interested now then Rheinmetall wouldn’t have bothered to propose it.
The fact that it’s on a Challenger hull is not what makes this vehicle interesting or unique, it’s the fact it’s using an autoloading 130 mm.
