Bismarck's armour scheme might not be as OP as expected

Its over-hated on, similar to how it used to be over-hyped.

The new “in” thing to do in naval warfare history is to bash the bismarck and to pretend there wad literally nothing good about it and it was just complete trash, which is just as rediculous as the people who pretended it was some kind of wonder weapon.

A great example of this being how Drachinifel bashes the Bismarck class for having flat armor on its turrets as well as angled armor, cuz “flat is bad cuz you dont get increased ricochet chance and improved effective thickness” but “angled is bad cuz it makes it easier for the armor to be penetrated at range due to reduction in impact angle”.

People just love bashing the Bismarck to build controversy and drive engagement.

I mean, it had poor armor design and thickness, bad guns, bad fire control, very bad AA, not particularly fast, and poor rudder performance. it was not particularly good in any particular field and bad across many of them

Armor design? Yes to some degree, bigguest issue was the things they didnt armor rather than what they did.
Armor thickness? It was pretty much middle of the pack with most of the fast BB’s of its time. Higher than Litorio, roughly matched with Richelieu, S.Dakota, and N.Carolina, lower than KGV, and thats only if you dont consider the internal armor, in which case im pretty sure it beats them all in raw thickness prior to the magazine or machinery.

The guns arent particularly bad either. They arent the 16" guns of the US/UK/JP, but theyre pretty analogous to the 15" from all EU nations.

As far as I can tell, the fire control was generally considered pretty good. It had some issues, namely the fact it wasnt armored properly, but it was far from bad at the time.

Absolutely. The AA on German BB’s was a sick joke, with some of the german cruisers and DD’s having some advantages over it, namely in medium range systems. Unfortunately the Bismarck class never lasted long enough for the possibility of a late war refit to 37mm autocannons and 128mm DP guns as seen on the cruisers and DD’s.

That being said, most ships with “good” AA in WW2 only gained said good AA later in the war from refits (or had access to VT shells in the case of the US and I think maybe the UK?), and by the time major AA refits were occuring, Bismarck had been sunk for 2-3 years, and Germany was very much struggling in other more vital areas than the naval war.

Tirpitz did get somewhat of a refit though. Much like Yamatos refit, it was all 20mm guns, bringing her number from 28 up to 58, but much like the Yamato, the refit failed to address the flaw in the AA armament, namely the subpar long range (105mm, should have been bumped up to the excellent 128mm DP guns the germans had access to) and medium range (37mm SK C/30 was horrendous and should have just been tossed into the ocean to save weight and allow replacement with the 37mm M42 or M43, which was analogous to the widely used 40mm Bofors).

Wasnt particularly slow either, faster than N.Caroline, S.Dakota. Similar speed to Litorio, and slightly slower than Richelieu.

Rudders were bad yeah.

It wasnt a titan of the pacific like the US and Japanese BB’s, and came from a country without the technical knowledge of the other nations it was competing against, and without the knowledge share othet nations were privy to at the time for their BB development.

The fact it competed in many ways to the ships of other nations is incredible in itself considering the circumstanfes of its building, and the fact you’re widely negative/dismissive about all facets of the ship class despite most of your points being demonstrably false proves my point about people juat being overly negative about the ship.

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Then it should have that reflected in BR, not pumped up because its famous or might make german players feel bad their TT end of the line doesnt have as high a number.

If its problematic at 8.0 wtf is the Gneisenau doing at 7.7.

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Speaking strictly in war thunder terms, its a breath of fresh air that a German turtleback ship didnt become number 1 simply because of its armor scheme. Lets look back at naval in WT for a moment.

Remember when Emden was released? Her modest ‘turtleback’ made her virtually immune to all other light cruisers at her BR. Then we got the Admiral Hipper, a heavy cruiser whose armor scheme was agreed as not great. Unfortunately for us, her turtleback was still thick enough to bounce every single cruiser caliber gun in the game. Making her also, the top dog of her BR.

Then finally, Scharnhorst, oh the bullshit that was her. A ridiculous curved turtleback that allowed her to bounce 16" shells travelling at orbital velocity with over 20,000mm of penetration! Instant meta God of naval, matches were entirely dictated on which team has more Scharns than the other.

So excuse me for giving a sigh of relief that Germany didnt get another meta God ship because of how wacky this game is at modeling turtlebacks. Yes, it sucks that she isnt good in the top tiers and Germany could use H-39 to bring their fire power up to par. But again, im just happy that our fears of a unkillable Bismark was unfounded.

They still at least have Gneisenau, which is a Scharn with 15" guns in a vastly lower BR. With only way to kill her RNG dependent, I predict she’ll be the real star of the German blue water tech tree.

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Yeah this is exactly my emotions right now.

When this round of BBs was hinted at. I was somewhat concerned about Yamato and Bismark just being absolutely cracked. Scharnhorst 2.0 and Amagi 2.0. But thankfully, both seem to have some pretty major weaknesses that will limit their performance enough to be a fair fight usually for me in Vanguard or Rodney.

But instead… we seem to have to worry about Kronstadt 2.0

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adding tirpitz solves SPAA and adds a lot of stuff she definently should be added after the scarnhorst

I think you opinion about Gneisenau is not completely right. Now in this update, using French 330 or American 356 can still cause damage and fir on Scharnhost’s ammo elevator, and in next update, BR7.7 can still meet them. But we all know Scharnhost’s hull seems lower than Bismark, so it maybe its ammo elevator have a fewer chance to be hit than Bismark. Overall, Gneisenau will be the only ship which have better survival ability in German navy since next update.

More or less Yamato and Bismarck are balanced but of course the Soviet ship is the modt powerful one there it figures…honestly if it wasnt for Soyuz all the new top BBs would be fairly balanced since they all have strength and weaknesses to a good degree but soyuz is just the perfect BB for WT gameplay purposes right now.

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No, then it would be world of Iowa at that point.

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Iowa isnt invincible tho it has weak spots and while it has a good reload its damage isnt anything to write home about. I think the other BBs can still do something.

Soyuz on the other hand is just straight up broken. It would be more balanced if it wasnt for that soviet ship.

Well, I think Iowa without Soyuz will be more imbalanced than Soyuz with Iowa. That’s my impression with I using both ships on dev server.

I agree, after an update during the 2nd dev server Iowa’s shell room has been subdivided - now by taking less than 50% ammo she can remove all shell rooms inside the barbette, a long requested buff for US battleship players. The only weak spot of Iowa is the frontal bulkhead which is not as invincible as Sovetskiy Soyuz but otherwise she’s outperforming everyone else by a significant margin just like the Soyuz at this moment

And we know that Iowa doesn’t rely on frontal bulkhead like Soyuz as side armor is much stronger and Iowa class cannot fire freely on front XD

Also to be minded that Missouri and Wisconsin had their frontal bulkhead reinforced to 14" from 11" on Iowa and New Jersey. Imagine Missouri comes to this update instead of Iowa she would have been just as broken as Sovetskiy Soyuz

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Yeah that’s what I want to say but don’t say. I want USS Missouri as September 1945 and Wisconsin in version between 1945~1952. I’m pretty sure all Iowa class will be in game one day as they are most famous

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will tirpitz be tech tree or event or premium im praying shes not premium and will her black and white paint job be avalible like PRINZ EUGEN or will we have to get it from crates cause crates are a scam
Tirpitz Camouflage

and will bismarck be getting her skin
International Naval Research Organization Articles - Bismarck's Final ...

Dont think Tirpitz will be premium because of Gneisenau.

i pray that they dont cause when rank 9 comes theylle need a premium for it