What tank is better to grind British tech-tree: Challenger-1 DS or Challenger-2 OES? I do not consider unarmored vehicles and I play only ground battles.
DS as the oes is worse at its br
I see. As I understand those new premium tanks (Click-Bait and OES) fight VIII tier vehicles what is not a preferred situation.
Challenger DS by far, the OES is solid but much harder to use for the BR it is at, it is heavier, has better ammunition but lacks the speed and the technology the OES goes against makes it harder to effectively use the armor on the Challenger 2s.
The Challenger DS has better armor, and a still very punchy gun with a very solid reload for it’s BR.
If it had to be a Challenger the DS. The OES like all Challenger 2s has more bugs than a Bethesda game.
If you are willing for other vehicles I recommend the Centurion Action X as it is a fun one.
Along with what others have said (DS is a far more competitive tank at its BR than the OES is, CR2s are buggy as hell right now)
The 10/10.3 line-up is also generally just better as well for Britain. With more tank options, a “usable” IFV and maybe someday, a useable SPAA system. Not too mention really good helis (G-lynx is really good if you wanted a premium heli) and the Jaguar Gr1A and Sea Harrier FRS1e are also both 10.3.
OK. Challenger-1 DS has two APFSDS rounds available: L23 and L23A1. Which one is better in AB and RB on practical terms?
L23A1 is the upgrade over the L23. British Shells go:
L23 > L23A1 > L26 (found on the Challenger Mk3 and up) > L27A1 (found on the Challenger 2s)
it is currently recommended to never take any HESH rounds (L31A7) because it causes all shells to become HE when hit.
(Fun fact, The Challenger DS should have L26 rounds as that is what the tank used historically in Desert Storm (DS), but they have been denied due to “balancing reasons”)
OK. I have noticed now British top tier tank is armed with German gun.
Yeah, thats because rheinmetall is helping to modify Challenger 2s into Challenger 3s
Currently, the UK is looking to upgrade 148 Challenger 2 MBTs to the Challenger 3 standard, which will see the integration of a new turret, improved sensors and optics, and the smoothbore L55A1 120mm gun from Germany company Rheinmetall. - Source
Unsure what shells are planned for it, it might be a new UK round, or it might be a renamed German/“NATO” round. But the key idea is to add that inter-operability with the Leopards. (I think there is a new shell being devleoped by UK and Germany that is slated for the CR3)
(In game, the main reason for them adding such a modern tank, with different shells, is because the L27A1 is underperforming due to missing game features)
Isn’t L28 export round any better?
L27A1 is Depleted Uranium. L28A1/L28A2 are Tungsten Alloy.
- L27A1 APFSDS: Also known as CHARM 3 (CHallenger ARMament 3), it features a longer penetrator made of depleted uranium to defeat complex armour arrays and advanced forms of ERA. The 120 mm Tk APFSDS CHARM 3 uses the safer L16A1 CCC (Combustible Cartridge Case) charge and is designated CHARM 3A1 when using the L17 bag charge. The L27 entered in service in 1999. Muzzle velocity is 1,650 metres per second (5,400 ft/s)
- L28A1 APFSDS: A private development initiated in the late 1990s, Royal Ordnance Defence began the development of a new tungsten alloy long-rod penetrator APFSDS-T round (the L28) to enhance the appeal of the Challenger 2 tank on the export market. By late 2001, the British Army had begun procuring the L28 round.
- L28A2 APFSDS: A newer export 120 mm APFSDS projectile designated L28A2. The UK Ministry of Defence funded the L28A2 work specifically for Oman, which wanted to replace its old L23A1 APFSDS. The work on the L28A2 round also included some of the technology incorporated into the CHARM 3 (C3TR) propelling charge system already in service with the British Army. This used a British low-pressure charge system and advanced penetrator material, as used in other in-service rounds. The L28A2 contract was supposed to enable BAE Systems Land Systems to complete the de-risking of the L28A2 in early 2008. Qualification tests and mass production were scheduled for 2009. - Wiki
There are times where Tungsten is better than DU, but for the most part, DU is better.
Which is part of the reason why the UK is developing a new round, the standard shells for the Leopard are not DU.
The switch to a smoothbore 120mm main gun for its MBTs will see the UK join the US and virtually of its other Nato allies in operating such a weapon, offering the opportunity for collaboration on upgrades. The 120mm L30A1 main gun of the Challenger 2 is rifled, and thus saw the British Army maintaining a weapon system and ammunition stock unique from its Nato partners.
However, one possible loss to the British Army with the removal of the L30A1 and moving to the Nato-standard German system is the lack of depleted uranium (DU) anti-tank round for the L55A1, as is currently the case with the Challenger 2 and its CHARM 3 ammunition.
It is likely that the joint UK-German development of a more lethal round for the UK Challenger 3 and German Leopard 2 fleets is in part an attempt by the UK to offset the loss of a DU penetrator. - Source
Are smoke rounds useful in this game on higher tiers?
They can be, ground is not my main gamemode, so someone else is probably better suited for helping with specific tactics like that. I think they are handy for when you want to create a smoke screen before crossing a gap for example
I don’t find smoke rounds all that useful. I just stopped even trying with them. As they require you to reload and you’d only do that if you fired at something.
This is indeed the case in War Thunder, because the formula algorithm in the game focuses more on speed and armor piercing length, and does not increase the penetration of (DU) ammunition, but decreases it (due to slower muzzle speed), so the L28 is probably better than the L27 in the game
This also means that the DM53/63/73/KE2020NEO K279 type of ammunition is more suitable for the environment and formula of the game than the M829 L27 3BM59 type of DU ammunition
L23 has also wolfram penetrator so it should perform better but L/D 14:1 isn’t brilliant.
I wish the chally DS got the L26 and went up to 10.3 with the other premium mbts. It would be more historically accurate, and would make it fit with more vehicles at that BR for a lineup.
lets be fair, here in Britain we wish for a lot of things but rarely get them… like a functioning SPAA at 10.3…
or a competitive top tier fighter (praise be to Saab and by extension the Gripen)