B1 Bis n° 505

[Would you like to see this in-game?]
  • Yes
  • No
0 voters

Salutations everybody

I am suggesting B1 Bis n° 505 as a new tank for the French ground forces. 505 is a bit different from the other members of B1 family as it was a late production model with an modified rear end and was sent into battle as a SPG.

image

charbp3s11-c2291c2a84babeebbdd3366f924a3

Numbers 505-507 were specifically ordered in June 1940, without the turret due to a lack of availability. Instead possessing a hole where the turret should be (only Italy put a 60mm cap over the opening) and the addition of a 170 litre fuel tank leading to a slightly modified rear end. It is worth noting that nether 506 nor 507 had this modification. Otherwise the tank has the standard armour and ammunition as the standard B1 Bis. It was seen as a last ditch effort by the French to hold the line although it should be noted that it now gained a lower silhouette while keeping its very powerful main hull cannon. In addition the commander now had a far easier time with his job with the removal of the one man turret. It is unknown how well it performed in combat in this new form.

Initially 505 and the other decapitated tanks were assigned to the 46e BCC however they were transferred to the 47e when 47e started suffering from losses in battle. At one point 505 was used briefly as a military tractor and ammunition carrier. The vehicle remained in service until June 1940 when it was confirmed to have been destroyed at Tournon-St-Martin. The other turretless B1 do not appear to have been knocked out at the same time. In particular another pair of turretless B1 Bis, n° 551 and 550, were abandoned at Bessines, 38 km north of Limoges on June 25, 1940

However it wasn’t the only one to gain this new look. There are different sources claiming how many actually got this unique treatment (505-507) were specifically ordered this way. Not only were there others, but France wasn’t the only ones to posses it. With defeat near several French factory works decided the best thing to do was keep them out of German hands by hiding 8 B1 Bis’s, half of which lacked the turret, in a cave near Baux en Provence in July 1940. However the plan was exposed when an Italian worker revealed the location to Italian authorities in Oct. One turretless tank was tested, but nothing further was done with them and they were most likely scrapped.

In game this vehicle could act as a heavy French tank destroyer that while well armoured and still having the 75mm would have to now contend with strafing due to the now open top.

More photos

image
image
image
image
image

The Italian turretless B1 Bis

image
image

Standard B1 Bis blueprints (doesn't include the extra fuel tank on 505)

image
image
image

Sources

CHARS B1 et B1 Bis?
Tank Archives: Char B1 bis: General Estienne's Legacy
World War 2 In Review: French Fighting Vehicles, Issue 1, Merriam Press,

3 Likes

+1 at br 1.3

1.3? Hell naw. At least 1.7, or probably 2.0

You realise you this tank has basically no gun traverse and is technically open topped so it can get overpressured.

2 Likes

It also is frontally immune from most autocannons, and also the short 37,50, and 75mm cannons

1 Like

Load HE, aim near the open top then it will be over for the 505.

So? In that time it can still shoot to kill.

The howitzer is hard to aim with no horizontal traverse, it will take a long time for the 505 to adjust and aim. Low tier tanks are fast and nimble and could evade getting shot

If you can’t aim faster than something that has to use the hull-aiming mechanic, that’s a bad sign.

1 Like

How would an SDKFZ-140/1, SDKFZ-222, or really any auto-cannon platform deal with it?

They can run from it, how does a m18 deal with the T-95?

The M-18 can kill a T-95 thru the side though

my bad, how about a fox?

Fair point, but that is also a problem and not a positive for the game. Situations where one tank physically can not kill another should never occur in the game, and creating these situations should be avoided at all costs

Fair opinion

1 Like

This looks like fun

1 Like

I suggested the italian use of it so +1.

1 Like

or we can pull a quick one have the italian one in france.

The italian one in italian tt, the french one in french tt.

2 Likes

A heavy tank destroyer in low tier for France ? Count on me.

+1

2 Likes