how about F-CK-1 series?
Yes it will be nice.
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This is just an example. The logic behind this proposal is the same as the Tiran 6 tank: it’s a Soviet T-62 with a few minor modifications. The possible Israeli technology in the Colombian Gripen (if the contract is signed) could be part of the Israeli TT. But the topic here is the possible Taiwanese Rafale. :D
Except difference is that while Tiran might be at core T-62, it was modified by israelis and was in service with IDF.
Gripen E/F was never in service with israel, and colombia isnt a subtree of israel.
Columbia isnt subtree of any nation for that matter.
Unless Columbia gets added as subtree, such gripen would go to the manufacturer - that being sweden.
You can see this with the israelis very own Kfir C.10, which went to the manufacturer - israel. Or the F-14 IRIAF - iran isnt a subtree, thus it goes to the manufacturer, USA. Even tanks follow this suit - argentina is not official subtree, so all argentinian TAMs went to designer, that being germany.
Just because columbian gripens might have been modified with israeli avionics wouldnt justify their addition to israel.
That is true but that debate effectively hangs on whenever IRL taiwan will procure rafaels or not.
Wow bro ok, that’s your point of view but when you say “wouldnt justify their addition to” it’s as if you don’t want it to happen but you don’t allow others to suggest it either, its just a suggestion, anyway the more vehicles are added the better for us because that gives variety, more if they have unique characteristics (like the example I gave) and the logic of a Gripen with a Colombian flag in Israel TT is to maintain synchronicity given that there is already a vehicle in this tree (even if it is not a subtree like Pakistan in China or India in URSS)
Not even my point of view, just describing how how things seem to be based on what gaijin presented us so far.
Subtree/TT if operator country operated/trialed/captured → special cases as Canada and australia that go whenever neccesary (gaijins word not mine) → manufacturer/designer of vehicle if operator isnt present as subtree/TT → everything else
You take it too personally. This is a forum, you presented opinion, you should be prepared to defend it, just as anyone else.
By wouldnt justify im just saying that merely because it has israeli systems integrated the link isnt strong enough to justify their placement in israeli TT when manufacturer country (sweden) is in game.
TAM 2C and TAM2(IP) are both tanks in argentinian service, argentina isnt official subtree. These two variants especially are modernised by israel companies. Yet they are in the german TT, because they designed the base TAM.
F-14 IRIAF is/was in iranian service, iran isnt official subtree. It was modified to fire R-27R, russian missile. Yet it is in US TT because its US designed and manufactured plane.
Kfir isnt in israeli TT because it has israeli avionics, but because its a kfir, an israeli plane.
Thats the difference between Gripen and Kfir.
If such plane was to be added with columbian flag, it would go to sweden.
Only way Rafale could be added to the ROC is if the ROC already received them or ROC pilots themselves have flown them.
Similar situation to the Indonesian Rafale - no suggestion on it yet as its still awaiting delivery but Indonesian pilots have flown the Rafale and we can expect the Rafale to be added to the Thai-Indonesian Subtree for Japanese TT.
Ok, that sounds much more reasonable, anyway the reason why subtrees are created is also to maintain the ability to add vehicles in TTs that don’t have as much variety or also for balance, for example the Hungarian Gripen in Italy, I can conclude that you are quite right but that it is most likely that another TT is needed in the game, right?
Probably, issue is which.
I forgot to bookmark it, but gaijins stance on new TTs is that if tree or rather, nation, cannot stand on its own without help of several subtrees from different countries, it wont be added (due to how negatively was israel recieved).
Not saying this is right or wrong, just how things are. Obviously its a major blow to minor nations.
Another issue is that there arent that many “big players” left to add, as outside of the major arms export powers, every TT will either have WW2/Cold war copypaste, top tier copypaste, or its tree will be copypaste all the way from initial BRs to top tier.
While everyone will likely want to see their own country in warthunder one day, the harsh truth is not everyone would have such emotional connection, so such would-be tree would need to offer them more than just another remix of Shermans, T-72, Leopards and MiG-29s/F-16s.
Few nations that come to mind are Yugoslavia, or India. But India was already confirmed as subtree for UK, so…
Then theres yet another problem with such would-be additions, and that is ability to field a BR appropriate lineup on more than few BRs. Minor nations, due to one reason or another, simply dont have the neccesary selection of vehicles to form a lineup, and have TT without gaps. Just look at how current TTs sometimes have massive gaps in SPAA section, yet people are calling for addition of nations that would not be able to field more than few SPAAs.
China doesn’t even have the J-10C, any J-16, J-15 or Su-30, there’s no reason they’d get something like the Rafale anytime soon
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Éric Trappier said: « Vous savez très bien ce que veulent les Taïwanais. Ce qu’ils veulent, c’est le Rafale. Mais ça ne dépend pas de moi. Je ne dis pas que c’est bien de vendre à Taïwan. Ce n’est pas ma responsabilité, c’est celle de l’État. »
That is: “You know very well what the Taiwanese want. What they want is the Rafale. But that doesn’t depend on me. I’m not saying it’s right to sell to Taiwan. That’s not my responsibility—it’s the responsibility of the State (France).”
At the moment they are only considering a possible sale; it doesn’t look imminent. There isn’t even a signed contract. If and when such a deal ever materializes, then it will be worth discussing—but right now the fundamentals are not in place.
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We’re more likely going to see an Indonesian Rafale come to Japan than this, and theirs have been in the works for a while, and only just coming into service
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Tbh I’d rather see Japan get the Rafale than China, they have a bigger need for top tier stuff while China has plenty jets to add already. But I’m still against Rafale copypaste overall though
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I’ve done China, and am in the process of finishing japan, I see far more growth from the former in the coming years, tons more 4.5 and 5th gens left to add, with increasing capabilities like AESA and EW, while japan is pretty much relegated to F-35 and subtree vehicles.
So I agree, Japan deserves a Rafale in order to bring diversity, something china already has with it’s unique top tiers and taiwanese influence
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If only the super kai had at least one built
Woulda made a nice 14.3 at least
No lol, we have so many tanks that never entered service or ware never even build
Yes but no imports (well except the F-16AJ but who on earth is ok with its existence)
aight I bite, give me a example of vehicle that finds itself in similiar situation like swedish SLM or this would-be taiwanese rafaele.
what? i just said we have multiple vehicles in game that ware never used/produced
i was being sarcastic. of course we have prototypes. These arent in the same ballpark as planned accquisitons of already existing hardware.
Sweden might wanna get SLM, but gaijin cant add it until it actually enters service, because Sweden can at last minute decide they dont want the SLM.
If gaijin did add SLM before then and sweden changed its mind, now sweden would be left with AA system they never operated. Same with rafaele in taiwan service.