Aircraft weights in War Thunder

[l2ulan]

Currently there is no way to report incorrect mass of aircraft, their engines, fuels, oils, or max payloads. Only certain information is displayed in the game, and reporting based on datamine information is disallowed.

Let’s use the aircraft I’m currently looking into as an example;

This is the information we can see in the statcard for the Brigand B.1, it shows some specific data about the aircraft and its performance.

In X-ray view, hovering over individual components such as the engines, fuel tanks, or armament will give you further information. If it’s visible to the player in game, it can be used for a bug report.

Now let’s look at some problems;

Line 1923 Takeoff appears to be the maximum take-off weight for the aircraft, which is not visible in game but is very important as it affects the aircraft’s maximum bomb payload. Note that Takeoff mass for the Brigand B.1 is set as 17690 kg.

Three max take-off weights are shown in the Brigand’s Pilot’s Notes. In metric, they equate to;

1. Overload - 40,000 lb (18143.7 kg)
2. Normal - 39,000 lb (17690.1 kg) < the figure being used, according to the game code
3. Landing - 35,000 lb (15875.7 kg)

Source

So the aircraft is currently using its Normal (all permitted forms of flying) max take-off weight, resulting in a lower limit for suspended armaments.

Many aircraft in the game use Overload weights, it often depends on when the aircraft was introduced to the game or what documentation is available, or how test standards were applied. How can this be reported?

It can’t. Aircraft weight, fuel, oil, etc. are not displayed in game and any bug report trying to change them will be dismissed, as datamine information is not permitted to be used in bug reporting.

We shouldn’t be resistant to change. The UI changes in Ninth Wave have been a little different to what we were used to, but I think they will be found to be positive eventually. Likewise more visible information, which we are subject to, will in my opinion help improve the accuracy of the game experience.

Can we please have the following figures (which are present in the game code) displayed in game?;

• Empty weight
• Max fuel weight
• Oil weight
• Takeoff weight

[Master_Teaz]

They said they’d “Give us new tools”, like, 6+ months ago

I’m still waiting on this is report the F-86K and other’s weights,

maximum Fuel capacity will also be extremely useful to see, as that is wrong too, often, luckily i shoehorned my Eurofighter report in just before they banned Localhost for good

Thrust curves will also be very useful, as the single engine thrust value is misleading, as some aircraft have very poor low speed thrust and some others excellent,

[Real_K_Soze]

@l2ulan

It can’t. Aircraft weight, fuel, oil, etc. are not displayed in game and any bug report trying to change them will be dismissed, as datamine information is not permitted to be used in bug reporting.

I saw your bug reports. From my pov you should try to find a Brigand captured by a foreign country and recommend a premium version for the USSR tree. After implementation in the USSR tree everything goes…

[l2ulan]

Yeah a simple in-game graphical representation of performance figures would be great, and would help the player understand their aircraft.

Fuel is a big one, though on Brigand B.1 is incorrect only by 1 kg (likely due to rounding);

From calculations I’ve done on a number of aircraft, Gaijin appears to use 0.72 kg / litre for aviation fuel.

[l2ulan]

Yeah I guess I should have suggested the Pakistani Brigand B.1 first, at least that would get REDFOR backing.

[l2ulan]

Another example, visible when compared to datamined figures;

Seafire LF Mk III has a maximum take-off weight of 3400 kg, while the primary source states an overload weight of 8600 lb (3900.8 kg)

If all other figures are correct, this aircraft which is present in two tech trees is missing 500 kg of suspended armament capacity.

Missing armament aside…

[Nostalgistic]

Agreed. I have several potential bug reports lined up to address the majority of props and early jets. I hope they introduce a new visual information display for weights by this summer update. If not, that would warrant creating a new suggestion on the forum.

@l2ulan

• Max fuel weight
• Oil weight

I’d prefer displaying values in both weight and liquid measurements for convenience and accessibility.

In addition to your listed figures, the display should also include nitro mass or water injection mass. Some prop aircraft have separate weights and liquid measurements for nitro or water injection systems IRL.

It should also include the weight of fully loaded internal ammunition. For example, how heavy is a full ammo load when loaded into a Spitfire? As an extra, it would be useful to include the empty weight of mounted guns or cannons, though this is not necessary.

Finally, include the maximum custom loadout weight for external munitions, so we can know the maximum loadout weight the aircraft is permitted to take.

[HighRiskNoReward]

You can search “Aircraft name” + Warthunder and land on the warthunder wiki page for each aircraft and then you can check the base weight (empty weight + oil + crew)

The WTRTI database shows just the empty weights without crew or oil, or just without crew, I’m not sure.

If you need more information, you gotta dig in the files

[Nostalgistic]

@HighRiskNoReward

warthunder wiki page

The bug reporting platform no longer accepts the WT Wiki page for bug reporting. In fact, one of the BRMs said the official WT Wiki pages are not legitimate sources.

@HighRiskNoReward

The WTRTI database shows just the empty weights without crew or oil, or just without crew, I’m not sure.

Datamines.

@HighRiskNoReward

If you need more information, you gotta dig in the files

Again, that’s datamines. They DO NOT allow datamined values for bug reporting anymore, even if they are from files or third-party websites.

[HighRiskNoReward]

Yeah, essentially, gaijin doesn’t care and actively makes BS rules to shrug off reports. (you need to prove that there is an issue in our game without using any stuff from the game itself as proof… lmao)

Sometimes I come to the forum to vent about issues I find but I know the forum itself is just to talk to other users and gaijin doesn’t listen for the most part.

Whenever I try to report something, the requirements are completely ridiculous, and since I am not being paid to fix their game, I just don’t care to make an essay with baby steps and all the bells and whistles for the hope that the bug reporting managers decide to lift a finger once in a while.

[Gnza10091441]

There is clearly a lack of transparency.

It seems to me that Gaijin doesn’t want users to have too many opinions about decisions regarding vehicle characteristics (decisions they themselves know are arbitrary and wrong) so they prefer to restrict access to that information.

This reminds me of how corrupt governments limit or obstruct access to information on public procurement and salaries in order to conceal some fraud.

[Gnza10091441]

Another relevant piece of information would be how the liquid mass is distributed across the various modules and whether the intended volume is actually respected.

In the Ki 102, the outboard tank is supposed to have at least half the capacity of the inboard tank. But in the model, that doesn’t appear to be the case at all.

This raises suspicion that the modeler is shaping them by eye, rather than entering the exact parameters (even though all modeling software should allow for the input of an exact volume value).

Many aircraft are likely more prone to fires, just because their hitboxes are larger than they should be.

But there is no game data to compare.

[l2ulan]

@Stona_WT thanks for correcting