Abrams

[TheArcticFoxxo]

@Panther2995

Show me an video evidence where you consistently overpressure T90M,T80BVM and T72B3

You’ve been shown photo evidence where such was done. What difference is there?

If you really insist though… I’ll do it when I’m home.

@Panther2995

but wait you guys can only show me protection analysis results which everyone knows how inconsistent it is.

Can you explain to me in detail how it is inconsistent?

@Panther2995

So stop pulling bullshit excuse from your empty pocket and give me something good.

You’ve been the only one grasping at straws to disprove the myriad of screenshots of this exact scenario.

@Panther2995

UBH modification increases side protection against KE and CE ammunition but somehow it is irrevelant?

Are you blind, stupid, dense, or a mixture of all 3?

@TheArcticFoxxo

turret roof

@Panther2995

Commander sight,cupola or roof mg

You seemingly can’t read, nor show me any change the UBH modification makes to the turret roof to make the T-72B3 more resistant to HE than the T-90A.

I’ll just take it that you’re wrong…

@Panther2995

Its also quite funny how you changed shooting angles on those cupola shots in order to make sure rounds can overpressure in protection analysis, shows how desperate you are.

Who is “you”?

HE penetration is the same regardless of what angle it contacts at.
Again, more short straws. Keep grasping.

[J_ackal]

He’s not wrong. The 2a6 is on par if not better than every other MBT (Excluding the up armored leopards)

[Jεcka]

And you’ve judged it on what basis (that it’s better, including the Abroomz, since that poster mainly plays only them), exactly?

You’ve only got German & Russian MBTs (well, and the AIM, in which you’re performing worse than in the 2PL, an AFV that is objectively inferior to the AIM…).

[Panther2995]

@TheArcticFoxxo

You’ve been shown photo evidence where such was done. What difference is there?

And my photo evidence shows the otherwise, whats your bullshit excuse for that?

@TheArcticFoxxo

Can you explain to me in detail how it is inconsistent?

Playing dumb i see, sadly i dont have time to teach you basic things, learn by yourself.

@TheArcticFoxxo

You’ve been the only one grasping at straws to disprove the myriad of screenshots of this exact scenario.

I proved the opposite with my photo evidence, cope harder.

@TheArcticFoxxo

Are you blind, stupid, dense, or a mixture of all 3?

Personal insults i see, seems like your intelligence become insufficent so you decided to use brute force, how original.

@TheArcticFoxxo

UBH modification makes to the turret roof to make the T-72B3 more resistant to HE than the T-90A.

I’ll just take it that you’re wrong…

Yup ıt is confirmed that you cant read nor understand, thanks for proving once again.

@TheArcticFoxxo

Who is “you”?

Its is you, ı guess you also forgot what English is.

@TheArcticFoxxo

HE penetration is the same regardless of what angle it contacts at.
Again, more short straws. Keep grasping.

Is that the reason why in my screenshots it didnt overpressure both T90M and T80BVM, you’re getting more and more desperate, i love it.

[J_ackal]

Do you not notice the WR lmfao. Also I’m playing without premium, I had to grind the kekw shot which was tier 3 (what a joke), and also exclusively used it in top tier. Had no issue facing anything that wasn’t a leopard with it. Do I have to play the challenger and arietes to know they are trash? The chinese tanks are very similar to the russian ones. So that only leaves the merkavas and the type10/90 out I guess.

[Panther2995]

@Jεcka

And you’ve judged it on what basis (that it’s better, including the Abroomz, since that poster mainly plays only them), exactly?

Cmon Jecka lets be honest here, Leo2A6 is better than M1A2 series overall.

[J_ackal]

Only advantage I’ve noticed over the leopard is the reload. And the allegedly better spalling dart top tier abrams get

[Panther2995]

Despite having better reload i feel much more comfortable in my Leo2A6 due to having better Turret/Hull protection,much less exposed turret ring/not having exposed pumps in hull, Spall Liners, better Shell penetration/Muzzle Velocity and better commander thermals.

Only M1A2 SEP is equal to Leo2A6 in my eyes due to having better Gunner Thermals/Reload, similiar mobility, oh and MP HEAT.

[Jεcka]

@J_ackal

Do you not notice the WR lmfao.

WR is a team effort, lol. Look at your K/D instead (1.46 in the 2PL versus 0.94 in the AIM)

I had to grind the kekw shot which was tier 3 (what a joke), and also exclusively used it in top tier.

So have I? I’ve also the AIM, and had to play it with HEAT-FS.

Do I have to play the challenger and arietes to know they are trash?

Ever thought about why I name dropped the SEPs specifically? But hey, there’s at least a few that are better (because they fit the meta better).

@Panther2995

Cmon Jecka lets be honest here, Leo2A6 is better than M1A2 series overall.

Bro what, SEPv1 is outright superior to the 2A6 (better thermals on top of having somewhat effective side-protection, yes, I use TUSK on my SEPv1 and I’m loving it), M1A2 on the other hand is roughly equal to it. M829A2 simply spalls so much more consistently whereas the difference between A2 and DM53 in terms of penetration is irrelevant, and not to mention the 1s faster reload has saved me so many times y’all undervalue that way too much.

Despite having better reload i feel much more comfortable in my Leo2A6 due to having better Turret/Hull protection

Cool, but that’s like, subjective.

Versus M829A2. Their armor profiles are near identical.

[Panther2995]

@Jεcka

Bro what, SEPv1 is outright superior to the 2A6

Despite having better Gunner Thermals/Reload its equal to Leo2a6.

Leo2A6 has:

-better Turret/Hull protection
-much less exposed turret ring/not having exposed pumps in hull
-Spall Liners on Turret
-better Shell penetration/Muzzle Velocity

And if you equip TUSK1 kit you basically become less mobile than Leo2A6, SEPV1 advantages becomes Reload time and Gunner Thermal Sight only in that case.

I’d say Leo2A6 is still superior overall.

@Jεcka

M829A2 simply spalls so much more consistently whereas the difference between A2 and DM53 in terms of penetration is irrelevant

To me both shells spalls almost the same so i dont fell any difference, however bein able to target larger weakspot and sniping enemy tanks through longer distances is more important.

@Jεcka

not to mention the 1s faster reload has saved me so many times y’all undervalue that way too much.

Its niche positive side, i prefer fixed Abrams over 5second reload tbh.

@Jεcka

Cool, but that’s like, subjective.

I believe i clearly stated that it was my personal opinion.

[Nowel]

It is a 4mm plate of structural steel, plates this thin doesnt generate secondaty shatters in game.
For reference the 5mm that protects the armor on the challengers

[Panther2995]

Bro’s Screenshots are more bright than most countries future.

[Surbaissemaxxing]

[Nowel]

i dont know why, i think it is the hdr messing up with the brigtness but i dont see it as bright on my monitor

[Panther2995]

@Nowel

i dont know why, i think it is the hdr messing up with the brigtness

Might be,you might try use Graphic card application to see if it makes any difference.

[Jεcka]

@Panther2995

-better Turret/Hull protection

Yet, their respective actual not-on-paper protection is pretty much the same as top tier shells are simply far too powerful for their hulls (from any angle) and turrets (from wider arcs). So, how is 2A6 having “more milimeters” on paper exactly relevant when in-match situation doesn’t reflect what you’re saying?

much less exposed turret ring/not having exposed pumps in hull

Right, so you’re not going to mention that 2A6s hull is also a lot more exposed than M1A2s and is what gets shot “99%” of the time, then?

Seems to me like you’re trying to peddle an idea that M1A2s turret ring is the only weakpoint/weak area that matters in this comparison, when it isn’t. If you want to be objective then look at the sizes of each tank’s weakpoints.

Spall Liners on Turret

For God’s sake, if you’re getting hit in the spall liners which are pretty much located only on the turret sides you’re already dead. It’s a non-argument pretty much.

better Shell penetration/Muzzle Velocity

It’s a difference of like, 25mm? You’re just grasping at straws now.

however bein able to target larger weakspot and sniping enemy tanks through longer distances is more important.

How did you qualify how large a tank’s weakpoints really are against DM53 and against M829A2?

Its niche positive side

My man, this is just cope. One whole second of reload is what has seperated NATO tanks from most RU/Chinese tanks for the longest time, and it’s a huge advantage to have since you fire more often. What strikes me the most is how faster reload is apparently “a niche” to you when it comes to the Abrams, but 2A6s better “on-paper protection” is something that just has to be mentioned because it matters so much more.

And if you equip TUSK1 kit you basically become less mobile than Leo2A6

4.54s to 31kph, 10.68s to 50kph, 21.8s to top speed; SEPv1 w/TUSK and without one hp engine mod and “only” an expert crew.
4.39s to 31kph, 9.91s to 50kph, 19.78s to top speed; 2A6 with all engine mods and an aced crew

The differences between their acceleration are at best negligible, at worst irrelevant, and they would be even more if I had all of the engine mods on my SEPv1.

If you want to talk all-around mobility though, M1s reverse is better, their turning on the move is also better.

[Panther2995]

@Jεcka

turrets (from wider arcs). So, how is 2A6 having “more milimeters” on paper exactly relevant when in-match situation doesn’t reflect what you’re saying?

Like how M1A2’s right turret cheek is actually penetrable by DM53 on certain angles? I’ve yet to see same thing on Leo2A6, as for hull armor i think i’ll agree with you.

@Jεcka

Right, so you’re not going to mention that 2A6s hull is also a lot more exposed than M1A2s and is what gets shot “99%” of the time, then?

Right so Abrams giant lower plate that is almost equal to entire Leopards upper+lower plate doesnt mean anything?

@Jεcka

Seems to me like you’re trying to peddle an idea that M1A2s turret ring is the only weakpoint/weak area that matters in this comparison, when it isn’t. If you want to be objective then look at the sizes of each tank’s weakpoints.

Sure lets look, which tank does have more exposed turret ring? Which does have Giant lower frontal plate that is almost equal to entire frontal hull, which tank does have exposed hydraulic pump that is placed in wrong place, which tank doesnt have any spall liner?

This is unneccesary hostile behaviour is pointless, we’re just sharing our personal opinions.

@Jεcka

For God’s sake, if you’re getting hit in the spall liners which are pretty much located only on the turret sides you’re already dead. It’s a non-argument pretty much.

I disagree, those Spall Liners saved me many times while i cant say the same thing when my M1A2’s turret armor penetrated, why do you act like Spall liners makes no difference?

@Jεcka

How did you qualify how large a tank’s weakpoints really are against DM53 and against M829A2?

M1’s right Turret cheeks, iirc T72’s/80’s upper frontal plate and Chally2’s ufp are more suspectible to DM53, correct me if im wrong.

@Jεcka

The differences between their acceleration are at best negligible, at worst irrelevant, and they would be even more if I had all of the engine mods on my SEPv1.

So its either Leopard significantly lacks its mobility or your claim lacks certain truth.

Not to mention TUSK kit makes you HE magnet due to additional protection on roof mg, and it makes you to spot easier.

I dont understand why you became hostile since we’re trading personal opinions and in game values, your attitude changes quite fast when someone doesnt agree with you on leopards or Abrams.

I guess thats what happens when you consistently deal with Russian and Us mains but this is not the way to act like this.

[J_ackal]

I guess you also never use night vision in night battles

[Nowel]

That seems to be the case

[Jεcka]

@Panther2995

Like how M1A2’s right turret cheek is actually penetrable by DM53 on certain angles? I’ve yet to see same thing on Leo2A6, as for hull armor i think i’ll agree with you.

And this isn’t DM53 even, I’m using M829A2 here.

Right so Abrams giant lower plate that is almost equal to entire Leopards upper+lower plate doesnt mean anything?

See, now that I’ve called you out on not mentioning things, you finally have started to mention them, now, refer to what I have already posted:

M1s turret ring is its weakspot. Leo 2s hull is its weakspot.

And no, Abrams’s lower isn’t “almost equal”;

It about 1.4 times smaller in terms of coverage.

Sure lets look, which tank does have more exposed turret ring?

Funny thing, they both are pretty exposed in absolute terms as the protection offered by either is non-existent, but the only reason why 2A6s turret ring hasn’t caught on is because it’s not as much visible as M1s.

Which does have Giant lower frontal plate that is almost equal to entire frontal hull

Which it isn’t, refer to the screenshots above.

which tank does have exposed hydraulic pump that is placed in wrong place

Conga line vs hydraulic pump.

which tank doesnt have any spall liner?

M1s, sure, but 2A6s turret side liners aren’t a whole lot relevant, at least not any more than M1s frontal fuel tanks are (but hey, I’m down for you insisting that those spall liners are somehow doing “God’s work”, because then it gives me justification to start mentioning how M1s fuel tanks have saved my ass on many occassions, whereas the same can’t be said about the Leo 2s ;^). )

M1’s right Turret cheeks,

Feel free to guess which is M829A2 and which is DM53.

T72’s/80’s upper frontal plate

Neither has any real chance against T-72s frontal, their chances against T-80(U’s, specifically) is about 50% at all times.

Chally2’s ufp are more suspectible to DM53

Challenged 2’s upper frontal plate is worthy only about ~530 to like ~540mm RHAe KE if we were to ignore volumetric on the edge of adjacent steel plates, neither round has any issue with it.

So its either Leopard significantly lacks its mobility or your claim lacks certain truth.

Or, hear me out, M1s RPMs allow it to keep up very well despite taking up on additional weight, crazy I know. A 66.5 ton 2A7V is only about a whole second slower than the 2A6 when both have their crews aced, why would the 65.4 ton SEPv1, which when spaded has actually slightly more hp, be somehow significantly slower? The M1s are also go-karts at lower speeds compared to pretty much everything that isn’t a Type 10.

Not to mention TUSK kit makes you HE magnet due to additional protection on roof mg, and it makes you to spot easier.

Yes, I’ve noticed, but it’s not like this is anything new or shocking. NATO tanks have always been HE magnets with their CITVs so it’s a moot point if nothing else.

your attitude changes quite fast when someone doesnt agree with you on leopards or Abrams.

Because it’s one thing when you state that M1s are worse than the 2A7V, and another when all of the sudden 2A6 becomes the second-best MBT model in the game right after the up-armored Leo 2s, cause it has been “dethroned” from that position by the SEPs long time ago.