It’s pretty good but not against F-5s.
1- Plume size impacts front aspect locking.
2- No, it’d be 9.7, as all its flareless equivalents are 9.3 and 9.7 currently.
Mig-19S is vastly superior to the F-5C in dogfight performance currently, and that’s likely to not change.
You’re not forced to go full AOA, it’s as good as the F-5C in the dogfight, it just lets you pull more AOA.
@Italy_Suffers
Ah yes, the WT community all have takes worse than you. /s
and the F-5C on full rehaet with 2 giant plumes of flame coming out the back is colder by a significant amount than a Sea Harrier not even using water ejection.
As far as I am aware. Exhaust temps are not modeled at all. The game looks only at the engine temps. For example. IRL, it was entirely possible for a harrier to entirely negate a rear-aspect IR shot by angling the nozzles to 30 degrees and then pulling up slightly. This totally hid the engine exhaust from IR seeker head behind the target (say for example like those found on the Aim-9E). I am reasonably confident that in game. You’d still be able to lock on and fire under those conditions.
I think a 1.1-1.2x Temp multiplier needs to be applied to any and all aircraft when on reheat as a short-term stop gap measure until some proper IR overhauls can be done. That way in theory. All aircraft would be nerfed when it comes to sitting on reheat and just dropping flares whenever someone shoots at them would no longer be as effective. They would actually need to throttle down to dry heat, flare and probably jink as well.
Too many times have I see aircraft like the F-5, F-104, Mig-21, etc just defeat a rear-aspect Aim-9L (or even an IRCCM missile like Aim-9M or Magic II), whilst sat on full reheat, with a few flares. Maybe even 1 flare. This is totally and 100% inaccurate (as per these docs The AIM-9 Sidewinder missile - Information & Discussion topic - Page 34 - Aircraft Discussion - War Thunder - Official Forum)
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no, quite literally just you at the moment. you speak with the ignorance of someone who has NEVER even played the br with the way you pretend the F-4F is a good dogfighter or that the F-5E is somehow easier to lock onto than a phantom
It’s 2 relatively tiny plumes combined compared to a F-8E’s singular engine.
If engine temps were the only thing that mattered, then F-5E and F-4E would be identical in front aspect flare sensitivity.
@Italy_Suffers
Weird, since I have hundreds of battles at 10.3/10.7, and probably well over 1000 battles in the 9.3 - 11.3 range.
F-4F, which is lighter due to not having radar missiles, is indeed as good as the F-5E.
Not sure why you’re posting this as the first ever person on the War Thunder forums to post that; that’s not true currently.
and significantly larger than the no plumes of flames coming out the Pegasus engine and yet its super easy to lock onto a harrier at basically any range and aspect
Personally, I’d consider them about equal in a fight without any missiles. Since the F-5C has missiles, I would put it at a higher BR.
The Mig-19S has a better climbrate, but its guns are much more difficult to aim, and it rips if you pull hard when rolling. This, combined with its lack of roll and rudder usage at high speeds, makes it quite un-ergonomic, and not easy to fly.
That’s why the F-5C is 10.3.
Mig-19S’s guns are as easy if not easier to aim as they’re wing root mounted.
However, as reminder, MiG-21SMT/MF can go 10.7BR easier because of its performance and counterparts.
When MiG-21SMT/MF cmes in the game, F-4C which was top tier jets in USTT didn’t work as counterpart because R-60 worked as all-aspect missiles for somehow and we didn’t have CMs at that time.
For the first time they served as counterparts to the MiG-21SMT/MF when the F-4E/EJ was implemented in the game. The meta back then, unlike currently, was missing SARH missiles and the MiG-21SMT/MF didn’t have CM pods.
And since the F-4F doesn’t have SARH missiles and, in the current 10.3/10.7BR meta, they are quite close to the F-4E/EJ in the old top-tier meta, and since they once served as each other’s counterpart, the SMT/MF should also have the same BR as the F-4F.
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Its counterparts are all 10.3, that’s the thing.
F-4F is a superior dogfighter to effectively all of the 10.3s.
F-4F rates for reference:
12.8 at 450.
14.8 at 600.
15.6 at 900.
F-5s heat signature is a joke, they’re impossible to lock onto no matter how long you try until you get way closer than you have to with any other jet.
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You mean the counterparts of MiG-21SMT/MF in current meta or late 2019 top tier meta?
I’m sorry but, i don’t think it is “dogfighter” because F-4F can gets wiped by MiG-21SMT/MF on 1v1 duel situation. I don’t know about Mirage IIIE but, F-8E and F-5C, F-1 can outturn F-4Fs.
The only 10.3 aircraft that I can think of off the top of my head that the F-4F can win in a dogfight are the Su-17M2 and F-104J/G.
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If a Mig-21MF, the better dogfighter of the two 10.3 Migs, wins against an F-4F, that’s 100% skill.
Cause in an equal-skill match up, F-4F wins 100% of the time.
Only Mig-21Bis itself can go toe-to-toe with F-4F/F-4E, and even then F-4F might have advantage.
And yes, the Mig-21SMT/MF counterparts.
Has been said before really. F5C is capable of solving the global warming issue on its own
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No? It isn’t? We can duel anytime and you’ll go 0/10?
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WHAT? This ENTIRE thread is people telling you you’re wrong and that the F-5 has insanely hard to lock onto engines
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I have an F-5A and an F-4F.
Get in your F-5A/C and F-4F/E.
We’ll swap at 10.
I said F-5 is hard to lock in the front aspect, of which zero people claimed I am wrong.
Not only that, but engine locks are rear-aspect locks.
Front aspect locks are AB plume and airframe heat.
It doesn’t unless you don’t use sim controls lmao
Not sure F-4s can win against MiG-21MF even if you used sims…
F-4F/F-4E has better energy retention but, it is still F-4 and, you basically can’t try counter like that video because MiG-21 can pull so hard and it makes MiGs can stay at F-4s behind.
In rolling scissors situation?
Yes… 99% F-4 lose against MiGs because MiGs has bad energy retention.
Almost the only time an F4 can kill a MiG is by forcing to headon after losing turnfights because you can bring 50:50.
AIm-9L IRL was able to lock onto ships during the Falklands (in part due to the perticuarly cold waters) but they did genuinely consider (and on one perticular sortie, intend) to use Aim-9Ls as a anti-ship missile they were that good at locking onto targets.
But in game it can barely lock onto the exhaust plumes of an F-5 :D
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Weird since I’ve never lost to a Mig-21 non-Bis in the history of flying F-4E and F-4F, partially cause they’re an inferior platform, and probably partially because of skill.