50 Cal needs a serious buff

Machinery of War Discussion Aircraft
1

The 50 cal that is the mainstay for all US aircraft needs a serious buff. The M2 .50 caliber Browning machine gun needs a serious buff to remain competitive against the high-burst-mass cannons of other nations.

Why? Because US pilots frequently find themselves scoring endless “hits” without ever securing a kill. In an environment where a single snapshot from a 20mm or 30mm cannon can instantly obliterate a wing, the current damage output of American heavy machine guns leaves US aircraft severely disadvantaged in dogfights.

Metric .50 Caliber M2/M3 (12.7mm) 20mm MG 151/20 (German) 20mm Hispano Mk.V (British)
Muzzle Velocity 890 m/s (M2) / 880 m/s (M3) 705 m/s (HE-Minengeschoss) 840 m/s
Rate of Fire 750 RPM (M2) / 1,200 RPM (M3) 700 RPM 750 RPM
TNT Equivalent Per Shell 0.0g (Pure kinetic/incendiary) 18.6g (HEI Minengeschoss) 5.1g (HEFI)
Max Armor Penetration (10m) 31mm (AP-I) 27mm (APHE) / 13mm (HE) 32mm (AP-T) / 7mm (HE)
Arcade Free Reload Time ~20 seconds ~40 seconds ~40 seconds
2

me when i lie or absolutely bloody suck at aiming

12 Likes
3

Kinda feel like you should include average number of guns, ammo count / time you can fire and burst mass into that, because its a little selective.

For example:

P-51 (6x M2s) vs Spitfire (2x Hispano Mk2 + 4x 303)

Loadout One Second Mass (kg) Ammo Fire time (s)
P-51 6x M2 3.24 1880 25
Spitfire Mk9 2x Hispano Mk2 + 4x 303 3.28 (2.64 + 0.64) 240 + 1400 12 + 21

The flipside of the 50Cals doing less damage is that you are firing a lot more, with rounds that have a lower damage drop off and higher accuracy and much faster time to target, meaning easier to aim.

Now whether the damge is 100% right on the 50 cals. I dont know, but it is historically accurate they did less damage than 20mm canons. They are smaller rounds

Spoiler

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Now in my opinion. The issue is that rounds themselves, they are probably okay, The issue is the damage models, they are too fragile, and we should see at least a very very diluted version of the damage buff bombers got added to fighters, but I would like to see both bombers and fighters get a total overhaul of their damage model to break parts down into smaller segments.

So instead of a 20mm blowing an entire wing off, it blows a hole into the middle of it. Still serious damage, but not quite the same.

Though, ive never found that a 50cals are lacking in damage, and usually kill me in the first burst, especially in anything with a water cooled engine. (heck, im someone who rather enjoys running the 8x 303 Spitfires, and they really dont do much damage, but I still get plenty of kills).

You need to be aiming for the cockpit and engines in the US fighters. Its there you will shred.

Also, what american aircraft are you trying to dogfight in? If you are trying to win a turn fight against a Spitfire, you could have the best guns in the game, and it wont really help you much, and then if we are talking about jets, in something like the F-86? Then that is just under BRed anyway.

5 Likes
4

You know that those are not mutually exclusive conditions, right?

5

i have been using the mb 326b which has only 2 .50 cals and i can tell you, 2 of them shred the enemy even at 6.7

3 Likes
6

Correct. you may well be lying that the .50 needs a budd and have awful aiming

7

Ok but the fact that needs to be nerfed to 7.7 is another topic …

8

I don’t believe you … ;)

9

the buff is that instead of getting two guns, you get six

with more ammo per gun, better belts, better ballistics, and available from lower BRs

they are bad at the game and can’t aim

6 Likes
10

weird
when i played the f8f1 with 4 50cals i never had any problems with damage
so maybe you just need to aim

11

aren’t .50s the only guns right now that can consistently nuke bombers rn?

3 Likes
12

This post is a serious skill issue. .50 cals are OP right now, you usually get a lot of ammo, and they shred stuff while being fast rounds which makes aiming easy.

This makes things like the low tier bearcat with 4x .50cals very OP right now

3 Likes
13

Indeed they are! It’s either that or bringing artillery cannons if you want to bring a bomber down sometime within this week.

14

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let’s see how a top tier only player does rq

15

You’re already in a match so you can’t do it, but for best results I recommend taking off the gun mod. Gives your shooting a nice even spread.

16

hmm I see

turns out I don’t know how to dogfight with props
crazy

17

oh yea uhh
the d5 p51 is a bit of a boat

1 Like
18

I play top tier almost exclusively lmfao
but I know bs when I see it (.50 damage)

19

im aware

20

Lag pursuit all the way.

Pick the F-6C instead, better FM at a lower BR. The 4x .50 cals are still quite strong if aim is present.

Or the bearcat, or even the P-39/63