that’s the theory
in practice everyone shoots everyone at 15km at low altitude.
And i noticed players usually start “cranking” naturally by turning around the center of the map in a clockwise motion
in this kind of situation, a MICA would be more useful. Not to mention the seeker is probably quite better than the R77 or AIM120A, let alone the R27ER (notch, multipath…)
Multi-pathing is generally the same currently for all missiles. The seeker range likely doesn’t perform better than the AIM-120’s imo. I’d need to look into that further though, just assuming things because of the smaller caliber.
The R-27ER benefits more when both targets notch as it drags out the time to target for the slower, lofted missile as opposed to the brute force of the R-27ER. It just gets to target so much quicker. The only place the MICA will perform better is when it can reach the active range prior to the R-27ER reaching the target… which is pretty much <30km when both targets notch… not to mention some aircraft like MiG-29SMT can notch at almost perfectly 90 degrees.
AD4A is the name of the seeker used on mica, if that helps
As for the 27ER, it obsiously goes further, 1 missile weights 112 kg and the other around 350 kg after all. But my point was : it happen very often than 2 foes lock and launch at a very similar time, such as when i lock someone and the person i lock locks me right after because he feels in danger. And in this particular situation (which happens more often than not) mica and fox 3s in general will be better.
Not to mention going cold often weakens or breaks the lock on a 27ER anyway
Even if you launch at the same time, R-27ER generally reaches target first and the radar on SMT can notch at 90°…
The MICA won’t be considerably better at medium to long range. You can lose lock of the R-27 but it can regain it as it’s got IOG & DL
Also, chaff is going to be nerfed soon from rear aspect. You’ll need to notch.
Technically MICA and to some extent all Fox3s will have IOG and DL so re-acquiring targets is not what is going to make them so different also kudos to you if you have many missiles flying and you decide to re-lock with DL and end up sending all your missiles to one dood gonna happen a lot to average players i think lul. But i agree diff of speed and range will always be favorable for R27 hence even more broken with Mig 29 radar sector
FOX-3s don’t all go for the same target you’ve soft locked in TWS. The AIM-54 will continue tracking their original targets if you briefly hover over them on the scope with TWS.
Some models of the Su-27 will be able to guide two R-27ER at two separate targets as well…
Why are you telling me to cope harder?? I was pointing out the obvious
except i can maneuver so that the mig29 has to run right into my missile to keep me locked in that 90° gimbal limit.
Basically the R27 has to run twice the amount of distance the MICA does. And the R27 is by no mean twice as fast as a MICA. So Basically, either the mig29 breaks lock and runs for his life, or it keeps the lock but dies anyway and its r27 is trashed
If you and I both crank, you’ll be unable to crank as hard as the MiG-29SMT. Inherently, he has a faster missile and better long range maneuverability due to the much better kinematics. The SMT’s R-27ER will always reach the M2K’ prior to the MICA going active when launched from 40km+ at the same time towards each other.
This is already evident, you can even fight normal MiG-29G in BVR… the SMT’s ability to crank that much further can deny HPRF lock / track and also ensure that his missile reaches the target first.
It’s rather simple, the R-27ER is a monster of a missile. It’s a straight up powerhouse. The MICA is more useful for the ACM lock and fire meta but the R-27ER users will very much be a threat for the foreseeable future.
i specified the scenario above. If a mig29 fires a R27 at this distance, i disengage, go low and its missile won’t reach me. At close ranges, the mica is better.
Mig29 has to crank, i can turn cold.
Assuming the 29 manages to somehow hold a lock, by the time its 27 reaches me, he’s already dead, simply due to the fact that the best it can do is notch, while i can just run away…
We are talking low altitude close range fights here (15 km or less) I obiously won’t be fighting a R27 at high altitude, just like a mig29 wouldn’t be fighting phoenixes at 5000+ meters
I often launch and immediately unlock, your average player won’t disengage regardless. I unlock for two reasons, to loft the missile… and to reduce chance they defend immediately. It should be noted you must still be concerned about R-77.
No, you can’t. The MiG-29 will be holding near perfect 90° crank, you’ll need to maintain heading and close distance if you want to engage where he is simply guiding a missile. If you don’t continue on your course, your missile has no track data to eventually reach the target. It’s not fire and forget from max range… It needs to be given constant updates just like the R-27ER. It just doesn’t need the terminal guidance.
For the above reasons, this makes no sense. You can turn and run all game but that doesn’t do anything for you. On the same point, the MiG-29 can just skim the deck and force you to use IR only since radar missiles are useless… And he has more available ordnance currently.
Well, interestingly the R-27ET also exists. Until the M2K gets MAWS you’ll continue to be vulnerable to these. The R-73 is not a low threat either.
Anyhow, you’re fighting the point that MICA is certainly not too advanced for the game. It can come in December.
What is a fact is that Mig29s have a radar that can lock and maintain this lock from more than -90° to +90° and gaijin/some part of the playerbase still manages to say that if DL or better re lock features were implemented on other missiles than R27 would be unbalanced when a 29 can notch someone while guiding their missile if we bring th R27 subject back to Fox1s comparisions only.
And in the future i can only agree with Mig_23M that R27 will be a problem even if it’s SARH as you can just yeet the missile unlock and lock in terminal approach if you are skilled enough.
I’m not claiming anything. I don’t want the R-27ER in the game on the MiG-29s. I would however like to see the MICA in December… But Gaijin can’t even tell us why it’s “too advanced”. They had known well ahead of time that the Magic 2 was 50G, had IRCCM and felt the need to drip feed it to us anyway.
Stop the whole “well x country users…” Victimization game. It doesn’t help discussion at all. You’re what you seek to destroy in this scenario.
vv
similar kinematics anyway, but yeah much more a threat than an ER, we can agree on that
well it’s like running straight in a phoenix at this point… Awarness is important obviously
You know, there is very little data on the mica’s seeker, but considering it’s designed to shoot down sea skimming antiship missiles by all weather, i very much doubt multipath is a problem…
Not the first time a french vehicule is broken, we kind of get used to it unfortunately…
Not fighting it, it’s just that you seem to hold the 27 in such a high regard that it seems to you like it can beat a fox3 in every situation, which is just not the case.
Yes its kinematics will give it an advantage over early fox3s at high altitude, and yes it’s very potent, but no, it can’t beat a fox3 for any given scenario, and certainly not at low altitudes, where missiles effective range is drastically reduced, and therefore the maximum range of fox3’s seeker basically makes them completely F&F (10-15km or so)
Regarding multipath. Multipath sensitivity is going to be the same on all Fox3s i think so talking about how seeker would behave close to ground is irrelevant as of now as it is used as a balancing factor by gaijin and we don’t know if at low alts Fox3s will suffer multipath as hard as fox1s so that you always get a last chance against Radar missiles or if Fox3s are going to be resistant to multipath.
probably yes, but since we’re mentionning a fictive scenario anyway, i’m taking the real MICA as a point of reference (as far as i know it, obviously)
You can’t do that you have to consider gaijins modeling to some point in the equation. Here we talk about how gaijin balances things and from the overall direction of the game 27ER is kind of bound to still be better than Fox3s at the begining. Except if Fox3s seekers will be coded that much better to the point when you approach soil 27 will land in dirt while Fox3s will react and maintain lock and perform kill.
It happens to be maneuverable enough and have sufficient range / time to target to hit targets before their FOX-3s go active… at least until the AIM-120C-5 gets added.
Never said it could, I openly admitted that’s the case?
I really doubt MICA seeker is better than AMRAAM… We will see.
and i’ll repeat AGAIN. It depends on the altitude… But i sound like a broken record, so let’s agree to disagree.
I think radar seekers in this game are underestimated across the board anyway.
it is sufficient enough to hit things with a moderate sized RCS (sea skimming missiles) as low as 5m. i would be far from capable of stating if it’s better than AMRAAM’s seeker or not. if i had to take a bet, i’d say they are quite similar in performance, but that’s just a wild guess.
All Flanker family with PESA radar.