The french shouldn't have the dutch tech tree

Machinery of War Discussion
13

there both conisdered Fokker he moved to germany to study then made a company there
the original german FOKKER was just moved to dutchland and is considered a dutch company
Fokker (N.V. Koninklijke Nederlandse Vliegtuigenfabriek Fokker; lit. ‘Royal Dutch Aircraft Factory Fokker’) was a Dutch aircraft manufacturer that operated from 1912 to 1996. The company was founded by the Dutch aviator Anthony Fokker and became famous during World War I for its fighter aircraft. During its most successful period in the 1920s and 1930s, Fokker dominated the civil aviation market. The company’s fortunes declined over the course of the late 20th century; it declared bankruptcy in 1996, and its operations were sold to competitors.

At age 20, while studying in Germany, Anthony Fokker built his initial aircraft, the Spin (Spider)—the first Dutch-built plane to fly in his home country. Taking advantage of better opportunities in Germany, he moved to Berlin, where in 1912, he founded his first company, Fokker Aeroplanbau, later moving to the Görries suburb just southwest of Schwerin (at 53°36′45.90″N 11°22′31.60″E), where the current company was founded, as Fokker Aviatik GmbH, on 12 February 1912.[1]

same company different location even tho it was in germany it was considered a dutch company his first prototype was made in dutchland

looks like someone doesnt pay attention in history class

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14

afaik Anthony sold all his shares, assets, and/or whatchamacallits to Junkers before leaving Germany
the OG Fokker more or less ceased to be before he started a new company in the Netherlands
peak semantics (pedantry?), but the OG Fokker company was in fact German

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15

yeah it ceased to exist and was absorbed much like messerschmidt into air bus
but he still had there designs to bump start FOKKER part 2

In 1919, Fokker, owing large sums in back taxes (including 14,250,000 marks of income tax),[6] returned to the Netherlands and founded a new company near Amsterdam with the support of the Steenkolen Handels Vereniging , now known as SHV Holdings. He chose the name Nederlandse Vliegtuigenfabriek (Dutch Aircraft Factory) to conceal the Fokker brand because of his involvement in World War I. Because of the strict disarmament conditions of the Treaty of Versailles, Fokker did not return home empty-handed. In 1919, he arranged an export permit and brought six entire trains of parts, and 180 types of aircraft across the Dutch-German border, among them 117 Fokker C.Is, D.VIIs, and D.VIIIs. This initial stock enabled him to set up shop quickly

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16

I too can read wiki articles, no need to copy them here

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17

Dude it says that they are 2 DIFFERENT companies right there in the text you quoted - obviously you didn’t bother actually reading it!

Before the German company was founded - as it says in the wiki article…

Yes - and it is you - also get a refund for your English reading class.

18

The Dutch-German cooperation is often exaggerated while:

  • Franco-German cooperation (Maybe you’re also aware of the Franco-German Brigade? )
  • BeNeLux naval integration (BeNeSam = Belgian and Dutch navy admirality since 1948 pre-NATO)
  • Nordic defense integration (almost all North sea bordering Nations)
  • Belgian-Dutch special forces integration
  • Belgian-Dutch decades of on-and-off merged fighter pilot training

are conveniently ignored

Historically, the Dutch armed forces have never been a subordinate force to Germany in doctrine, command structure, or long-term strategic planning. Even during tight Cold War NATO integration, the Netherlands maintained an independent military doctrine, procurement policy, and deployment authority. Integration within NATO frameworks does not equate to absorption into another nation’s military ecosystem, otherwise most NATO nations would lose their national trees entirely. It is explicitly said so in 1 (German/Netherlands) Corps | Koninklijke Landmacht | Defensie.nl.

If War Thunder starts assigning tech trees solely based on temporary multinational integration, then countries like Norway, France, Turkey, Denmark, Canada, Austria, Greece, Belgium, and even Poland could be similarly absorbed into larger neighbors, which would be both historically inaccurate and gameplay-destructive in most cases.

Procurement ≠ political or military subordination

Leasing or purchasing German equipment (e.g., Leopard MBTs or FOKKER triplans) is a budgetary and logistical decision, not a declaration of military dependency. By that logic:

  • Many nations using F-16s or F-35s would belong to a US tech tree
  • Nations operating Soviet/Russian tanks would belong to the Russian tree
  • Nations using British naval weapons would belong to the UK

War Thunder has never applied this logic consistently elsewhere. And the netherlands also used mostly US, British and funnily also Canadian vehicles more than any german or coincidentally dutch-german projects.

The Netherlands:

  • Fought against Germany in WWII
  • Was occupied by Germany
  • Rebuilt its armed forces explicitly to deter Germany and the Warsaw Pact
  • Joined NATO as a founding member in 1949

Placing Dutch vehicles inside the German tree creates a direct historical contradiction:
You would be researching Dutch WWII resistance vehicles inside the same tree that previously invaded and occupied them. This is thematic nonsense from a historical progression standpoint. At least in France we don’t have that drivel.

TL;DR:

Placing the Dutch in the German tech tree is:

  • Historically inaccurate
  • Logically inconsistent
  • Selective in its application
  • Damaging to gameplay diversity
  • Disrespectful to national military identity
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19

Is we move away from recent political situation between Dutch and Germany, there’s also one argument that could be said for the reason as to why Gaijin decided to put Benelux in the French tree :
Dutch would not have brought much to the German tree. Their recent procurement is extremely similar to Germany, from Leo 2 to f35. Fokker has some unique vehicles but at BRs where Germany is already packed with interesting and potent vehicles. Dutch would have brought a few odd French based vehicles from the Cold War and a tiny bit of indegeous vehicles to Germany. On the other hand, adding Benelux to France allowed Gaijin to do simple and stupid copy paste to the ground tree and finally add a premium rank 7. For air, the initial line also brought some much needed diversity with Belgium and Dutch jets from the meteor to the F16. The more recent Fokker (while i dont play props anymore), also seem to fill up some French gaps from mid WW2 design (and give some diversity compared to the all those land lease vehicles).

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its not like the german tree doesnt have any Dutch vehicles already:
image

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german props are by far at most br ranges the least potent but same can be said for france atleast if you ignore there inported Spits and stuff

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22

I believe no one should’ve had the Netherlands, it should’ve been independent with Belgium and Luxembourg

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23

nah, it would have been a dogsh_t sloppy pasta tree for the most part
sometimes you just gotta be real and take a ‘greatest hits’ subtree over a sh*tload of vehicles you’ve already ground out in half a dozen other trees

24

It honestly doesnt matter, the french tree needed the help.

25

wouldnt go that far, plenty of french indigenous stuff they could have added instead
but given the current climate of ‘give everybody everything’ to appease new players its not a genuinely bad choice

26

One brigade was intergrated

27

I agree, but it seems snail is hell bent on drip feeding us native french stuff.

28

Said, “greatest hits” sub-tree isn’t even that. More like a collection of easy C&Ps that sit anywhere between easy buffs or simple reskins.

Said sub-tree missing 90% of the BeNeLux’s domestic and unique vehicles. Which becomes apparent if you look at the tech-tree suggestions or the suggestions for the BeNeLux nations in general.

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29

It’s not like we are getting a lot of unique Benelux vehicles either lol, appart from the fokkers

30

You’re not wrong. We STILL out here waiting for the amx 13-105 in 2025. Its shameful.

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31

It would be equally silly to add a Dutch Dr.1, because that doesn’t exist. The Dr.1 Triplane was only operated by the Germans.
Just because Fokker made something doesn’t mean that it can be added to a Dutch line/techtree.

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32

We will soon have another…

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