btw do we know if this is accurate?
Wasn’t that from Heatblur’s F-14 manual? DCS is not necessarily any more accurate than WT
1 Like
tbh i have no idea
The Mk47 mod 0 and Mk60 mod 0 motors have high smoke.
The Mk47 mod 1 has reduced smoke.
No AIM-54 ever featured with a smokeless motor.
1 Like
this was a heatblur thing and is outdated even they no longer follow these figures, the full version of outsiders view of AWG-9 system has true motor characteristics and I believe war thunder goes by those figures now aswell
1 Like
Just to check, the missile messages in SD/A mode are transferred to the missile how?
1 Like
for context
1 Like
Still really would love to see the 54C get its dogfight mode, pull better and better seeker… ATM, if you don’t get ur 54’s off the rail before you make it to like 10-15km, u might as well dump them cuz they’re worthless and heavy
7 Likes
It does seem that this new forum doesn’t allow me to edit posts which makes it a big hassle for this type of information aggregation thread.
Regarding the usage of the Outsiders document, some things are intentionally left in the air and are ambiguous since the document is intentionally structured in that manner by citing both official USN/Hughes/Grumman documents and 3rd party OSINT providers. The Outsiders document is the best document however in the case of WT. I’m trying to get my hands on some new documents but I’ll see how those go.
3 Likes
Not all of them is accurate.
Total impulse of the Mk60 and Mk47 Mod 1 might have some issue.
Additionally, it is known that Reduced smoke motor with HTPB have a lower specific impulse than contemporary CTPB with AI, so the specific impulse might be wrong as well.
The missile weight might be wrong as well,
it is not immediately clear why C is so much heavier, even with newer electronics.
The C might also have wrong warhead weight.
All in all, while contain useful information, not all of them is accurate
4 Likes
The AIM-54A uses Ammonium Perchlorate (Flexadyne), which can have an ISP ranging from 180-260s.
The HTPB in the AIM-120 has an ISP around ~245-255, (based on this report about reduced smoke propellants).
It is possible that the HTPB matches or improves on the ISP of the original motors, and is the only reduced smoke propellant type the US used prior to the late 1990s to my knowledge. 245 / 260 = 0.942
So we are looking at the absolute most difference, 5.8% worse specific impulse. This is assuming the Flexadyne has the highest ISP (260) and HTPB has the lowest possible (~245).
TL;DR AIM-54C may have worse performance than the earlier models due to a reduced smoke motor but should only (at most) be 5.8% less ISP.
1 Like
Anyone have that image of the AIM-54 flight trajectory vs long/short range targets that was posted on the old forums? its not there anymore
Can you describe the scenario better? I probably have it somewhere but I don’t know which one you want.
I more specifically want the image that showed the AIM-54 had a post launch climb period before it began SARH guidance. The image has all the guidance steps an AIM-54 took from launch until hitting a distant target, and also described the 2 target scenarios (long or short range) at the bottom?
This bit here:
Interavia World Review of Aviation, Astronautics, Avionics Vol.37
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/955829235493273680/1121576087026143283/image_1.png
1 Like
Thanks!
1 Like
According to Solid Propulsion Enabling Technologies and Milestones
for Navy Air-launched Tactical Missiles
The AIM-54A has 364 pounds of Flexadyne propellant, yet in-game the empty mass is 375 pounds less than when the burn starts. Also, it states the Mk60 is “functionally” a CTPB equivalent of the Flexadyne Mk47 based motors for the AIM-54A.
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1078877088087552102/1121631438073245747/image.png
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1078877088087552102/1121628905518931988/image.png
F-14 WSC can change radar target size, which will also send a message to the Phoenix when to go active. In DCS the ranges are documented as: SMALL - 6 NM, NORM - 10 NM and LARGE - 13 NM.
The LARGE is 24 km, which is close to the max 25 km range of Phoenix radar in WT.
DCS is wrong about the performances of the rocket motors so I’m not certain I can trust them on everything else. I’d need more sources.
Regarding the rocket motors propellant weight being incorrect; I have put in a report on this issue.
https://community.gaijin.net/issues/p/warthunder/i/r8SdwCrLivnX