Sukhoi Su-27/30/33/35/37 Flanker series & Su-34 Fullback - History, Design, Performance & Dissection
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Yeah theres def a lot of things they could do in hindsight. I think if they wanted to add R-77-1 and wait to see how it impacts the game before implementing fixes to western radar missiles, and in the extreme case, adding AIM-120C’s. That might be a better alternative.
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Most impressive thing the Su-35 will bring imo will be the Irbis-E radar. IRL accounts have it getting completely bricked by stuff like SPECTRA EW, but thats not a factor in-game, and being a slewable PESA with seemingly very generous mechanical + electronic slew limit, I think itd be quite potent in-game.
I’m curious to see how theyll go about balancing to factor in slewable ESA’s, since they threw balance out the window with the RBE2-AA AESA recently. On one hand, most nations should get ESA’s in the next update, to try to catch up to france, on the other, that skips quite a few radars/jets for some nations, while for others it means going straight to slewable ESA’s, which are (gameplay-wise) vastly superior to even the RBE2-AA.
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Add a new missile to Russia thats superior to every other missile in game.
On a platform that will have TVC and a PESA Radar and can carry 12 missiles.
Refuse the NATO alternative because Russia have it rough currently.
That seems balanced and a great idea.
Typhoon is great in flight performance avionics Radar are sub par. Only has 6 BVR missiles
Rafale has a great Radar and 8 MiCAs that are medium to short range. Great flight performance
F-15E is still the BVR king 8 missiles good Radar and flight performance.
Su-27SM sits inbetween these, it has good flight performance, carries a large ammount of missiles that are good. Has a serviceable Radar.
Su-30SM will have great flight performance, great Radar, TVC and with the R-77 (1) the best missiles.
In one update you completely invalidate the Typhoon, F-15E and to a lesser extent the Rafale
A missile that still has less range than AIM-120A. On a platform that weighs more and will have less thrust (reduced TWR), but will have TVC which only matters if you’re going to dogfight it, but even then it’ll bleed more speed, still have less countermeasures, lower climbrate and acceleration than NATO competitors but has PESA radar. Why leave out 7 factors only to mention 2? Further, like I said, they can always buff the AIM-120A.
A NATO answer is not a missile that would outclass R-77-1 on stronger platforms, that’s not the answer.
To my understanding Su-30SM will weigh more than Su-27SM and have less thrust than it.
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good flight performance against what? not against the gripen, or the EF, or the rafale, or the j10, f16 block 10, hell, even the mirage 2000 and maybe the f16c, this thing only beats the f15E/C now, the f15A is still pretty good ( again, talking about pure flight performance without the r73 saving your ass)
yes it carries 6 or 8 R77s which are less maneuverable than the micas in a worse airframe with worse radar and 4 more R73s which the enemy can simply pre-flare and avoid them since everyone has 150+ cms
-serviceable radar- D: lol lmao this damn thing sometimes refuses to lock with the HMD on an enemy approaching head-on at less than 9km
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Su-30SM will have a similar FM to the su-33, but with TVC
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Hello, @Gunjob, could you please inquire what the status of Su-27 IRST detection range reports are?
Specifically, these:
Su-27 IRST severely underperforming range
N001 (All), N010 (All), N019 (All) IRST still capped to 30 km
Su-27 IRST detection/tracking range too low
It seems that after the third report was marked as fixed, the devs have been under the false impression that the detection range is on par with reality and the 30 km has been removed (2nd report has a reply that 30 km was removed and 1st report is asking if the issue is still present).
Oh, can you also ask if afterburner detection has been enabled for IRSTs like it has been for IR missiles (that feature that made AIM-9Ds have some all aspect capability against afterburning targets).
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It has good flight performance it is fast and accelerates well, the fm change made it far more capable. You are also making comparisons to the Typhoon the F-16 early models considered the BFM benchmark and the F-15A and C which are hardly terribly performing aircraft.
Yes the Radar is poor as is the Typhoons, with slow update rate and “TWS ghosts”
Enemies can pre flare any IR missile would rather have an R-73 at the merge than an Aim9M.
Im going to make this statement now the Su-30SM will be the best jet in the game when it is released.
again, good flight performance against what? the clouds? the air?
these are planes that the su27 faces, apart from the f16 block 10, it faces the f16c, f15c/e and the eurofighter, the comparison is valid because it is literally what the su27sm faces on a daily basis and not you saying that the f15c is terrible D: it was literally the meta before the f15E
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I’m in the office next couple days so alittle busy, send me a DM so I don’t forget.
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What day would you want me to send you a message?
The difference in performance with the changes is not the gulf you perceive it to be. When a Flanker merges or gets into the midgame and within 15km it is a very scary prospect.
As I said the Su-30SM will fix all these inadequacies. TVC will allow it to be the best dogfighter, the new engines will give it the BVR power and the new Radar will make it deadly in medium range BVR even with the R-77.
I’m not disagreeing with you the F-15 platform is great as it should be, but the gap isnt a big as you make it they both do different things. More like comparing a 109 and a Spitfire and not a Sopwith Camel.
Su-27 is the meta jet at 13.0 it cleans house regularly
Even just F-15C ‘Golden Eagle’ bodies Su-35S.
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With all due respect, I don’t think you have the knowledge or experience to make a statement like that
the -new- engines are just the old su27s engines with tvc in it, so it will have less thrust than the current su27sm and also the su30sm is 1 ton heavier, it will not be great at bvr cause the r77 isnt great, the radar will help but thats it, the meta is how fast you can go to boost your aim120 to get kills, combine that with also having the best flight performance planes for this task (ef, f15e) and for close combat the rafale is king cause mica+hmd and also amazing flight performance.
this is a br compression issue, not the su27 being amazing and im only talking about the su27sm.
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This is the same Su-27 that faces the F-15 and F-16 aircraft at that BR and does well. That was my point, you are treating the Su-27 like it’s a Tornado and it’s simply not the case.
I have only flown a team mates Su-27 I have played against them on many ocassions and they are not free kills.
Yes BVR meta is to be fast and high…But you really shouldnt be dying to a 120 launched 40-50km away. Too many players ignore the RWR and do not know how to defend. At the same time you shouldnt be trying to BVR joust with an F-15E
Rafale is king of short range MICA with TVC is lethal. Even the Typhoon and F-15 die to Rafale in short to medium range envelope.
I have attached a video of how the Su-27SM should be played. In the correct hands it is very formidable.
See how the R-77 pulls so hard off the rail to make those shots the 120 doesnt do that.
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im talking about the su27 with the experience that i have with this plane.
again, the problem isn’t that somehow -the su27 is great-, it’s that the average player sucks even when they have amazing planes, I’m comparing the pure performance of the su27 to its competitors and the su27 is worse in almost every way against them, the fact that the average player is bad does not turn the su-27 into a great plane
and yes, bad karma is an amazing pilot, I won’t deny that, he is definitely better than 90% of the player base on air rb
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They want R-77-1 but don’t want enemy to have equivalent.
What is difference between R-77 and R-77-1, and between AIM-120A and AIM-120C-5?
Player level isnt a basis on how good a vehicle is. If anything it shows how easy Russians have had it for years before the addition of the recent gen 4 airframes.
Su-27 has shortcomings, it cannot be the best at everything right now it does most things well not great but well. Gaijin are trying hard to balance the game.
Typhoon should be the best at BVR but it isnt because Gaijin limit the Radars performance and deny the manufacturers flight performance data. They wont add the additonal Aim120 pylons. If they did this the Typhoon invalidates the F-15E.
Rafale and MICA EM range should be the same as an Aim120. But Gaijin have just given Rafale 8 MICA configuration, if they then increased the range it again invalidates the BVR abilities of the F-15E and the brawling abilities of the Su-27/J-11 and J-10
Su-27 carries the most missiles, it has good flight performance and a serviceable Radar. R-77 is superior in the mid/short range BVR as seen in Karmas video it pulls more G and can be deadly. R-27ET is a cool missile no other nation has that capacity.
Gaijin wont allow the Rafale or Typhoon to use IRST to DL Fox 3s. Short range the R-73 is the best missile (yes it can be flared)