Not reliable at all, IRST sometimes can lock at 20km, sometimes can’t at 15km, nowadays IRST really easy to be flared.
BTW, isn’t WCS should be capable to lock and track with PD and IRST simultaneously?
Sukhoi Su-27/30/33/35/37 Flanker series & Su-34 Fullback - History, Design, Performance & Dissection
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Only because it’s contemporaries are pretty much held back for balance purposes, based on secondary sources and asorted feels of the radar dev, or just blatant laziness on their part.
The APG-66(V)1 / -63 is missing TWS because ???
F-15 / F/A-18 / AV-8B / F-4F ICE radar range.
https://community.gaijin.net/issues/p/warthunder/i/W8lWB7cpXJX5
Sparrow AMRAAM functionality won’t be adjusted due to people thinking it “may be a bug”.
https://community.gaijin.net/issues/p/warthunder/i/T7jegF6n5BbR
Assorted F-15A & -15C radar functionality is missing.
https://community.gaijin.net/issues/p/warthunder/i/dtYrgKZUolFH
https://community.gaijin.net/issues/p/warthunder/i/IHyV66foPUUy
https://community.gaijin.net/issues/p/warthunder/i/VoRssKha8xH6
nonfunctional TCS on the F-14B.
AIM-9L Flare resistance.
https://community.gaijin.net/issues/p/warthunder/i/PV1HITijUnwT
AIM-9M Lock on range.
https://community.gaijin.net/issues/p/warthunder/i/PX7CKrwWNGdr
I could go on, but there is a lot wrong with the Teen series radars (let alone their ordnance, or peculiarities with their flight model) and as such are significantly underperforming, and its a fight to get basically anything corrected. on top of the fact that Gaijin seems to sit on many an issue or reject good reports for reasons unknown.
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I never said those contemporaries are historically accurate or not. I just pointed the fact that Su-27 in the game has a decent radar that lacks some quality of life compared to others. Aside from that, both Tomcat And Eagle radars underperform severely from what I see on documents etc. I’m fairly certain many radars in game lack capabilities of their real versions. It is so easy to break locks.
That is true but same could be said for ACM/HMD locks in some situations too. I sometimes lock chaffs instead of aircraft. Long story short, it works for me.
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It’s probably possible to rework it in a way that it’ll match the graphs while at the same time It won’t bleed a shit ton of energy tho.
Like a guy from this thread already said, what gaijin did to match the numbers was adjust the oswald coefficient without doing considerable changes for the other values from the flight model. This added to the fact that they made a poor instructor setup for both mig29 and su27 make they seem lazy asf like they have one job and they somehow manage to screw up lol.
Rn in RB it’s better to dogfight in a f*cking mig23 (the shittiest soviet fighter ever) than in a su-27 and a mig29, you have a video showing a real su-27 compared to the game one which is empirical proof that It bleeds almost 2xmore energy ingame but they still consider it not useful for reports, i’m Sorry but for a game that poses itself as realistic this is pathetic and unacceptable lmao.
Btw I know that’s not only the su-27 and mig29 that suffer from unrealistic flight behavior, f15c is Also Very SUS, but it has the amraams to rely on so ppl aren’t complaining much (like How russia mains were behaving when the r27er was the best bvr missile).
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Again, no.
The flight performance is good, not everything will have every advantage known to man against its’ peers.
The performance gap is so low, your average player will never be able to exploit it in RB. The benefits of having the best kinematic missile in the game (up to 6 of them and 4x R-73) far outweigh this.
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I agree that for the meta the gap is more fair than the previous one (r27er vs aim7m), but I think that what is bothering ppl (at least me), is that the best characteristics that made these planes iconic irl aren’t ingame right now… like imagine if they add the mig31 tomorrow and make it somehow one of the best planes for bfm, It would be absolute pathetic.
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At an altitude of 5 km and a speed of 0.6M, the aircraft must keep 5G
The plane doesn’t have any noteworthy performance advantages against any of its peers. It’s worse in one circle fight and it’s worse in a two circle fight. The only gimmick it has going for it is the gimbal limit on the radar and actually exploiting that advantage is limited due to poor flight performance.
The only planes at top tier or near top tier with worse flight performance are the F4F ICE and the Tornado F.3 Late.
And I don’t know why you are calling the R-77 “the best kinematic missile in the game.” The last information I saw is that it was one of the worst at longer ranges and just middle of the pack at closer ranges.
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Might be referring to the R-27ER
The weapons system is huge. More missiles of the best type in-game for kinematics. The R-73 is incredible in BFM when not thrown away. The dogfight performance is sufficient for air RB and makes reversals all too easy.
Players were scoring 100-1 kill / death ratios with the F-4E when fighting MiG-23MLD’s. That performance gap was much larger than what we have here. They did it simply by knowing how to reverse and force overshoots or avoid BFM when possible. They didn’t even have a PD radar.
I’m not, I never was. I don’t have the Su-27SM or J-11A. I’ve been doing just fine without the FOX-3’s thanks to the incredible R-27ER.
What’s your loadout for the Su-27SM?
I thought he was referring to the MiG-29SMT since that was what he showed in his clips.
If that is the case…then you get flight performance that is still inferior to F-16, Gripen, and F-15 but by smaller margins and you get a radar that is inferior by much larger margins.
The kinematics of the R-27ER are not enough outweigh the inherent advantage of having an active seeker. In my testing the R-27ER might hit the target around 1-3 seconds sooner than the Aim-120 if they are launched at the same time around 50km and the Aim-120 will go pitbull about 10-12 seconds before the R-27ER reaches its target.
The actual use cases for the R-27ER is to take out targets that are not pointing at you and for rear/side aspect high flyers. It’s the same niche as the entire plane where it basically is reliant on people not looking at and engaging you.
Can it work? Sure. It can work in the same way that even planes like F4F ICE can work. Does it make it good? No. Not really. Also does it mean that the flight model is accurate? Also no.
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4x R-27ER, 2x R-27ET, 4x R-73.
Still considerably better ordnance and fuel to stay on station for quite some time without a drop tank.
This has been proven false on many occasions now. The R-27ER when launched at long range will always reach the target first and with considerable time advantage. I can even fire at it and guide it long enough to hit you while still staying outside the MAR in certain scenarios. Especially with the MiG-29SMT.
It’s also better in head-on scenarios at closer ranges than some of the fox-3’s. I seem to have far less problems with them chasing chaff as well from side / rear aspect. Far more reliable ordnance.
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R-73 kinda makes up for the FM differences.
I haven’t tested the AMRAAM vs R-27ER launched at the same time but I don’t entirely believe that the ER only has a 3 second advantage at 50km. I regularly use the R-27ER at top tier and my missile will always reach the target first before the AMRAAM goes pitbull. Though I like to make sure my closure rate is very low at high altitude.
The ET is actually really good at this, no need to waste a good radar missile.
What player has a 100-1 kill / death ratio in the F-4E? No player that is normally playing the game is going 100-1 in the F4E without relying on bringing an entire 4 stack into the game with them, farming AI, and camping in their Airfield AA when even mildly threatened.
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An exaggeration for sure, but not untrue. The players that were doing this show that skill actually matters - and as I said the performance gap is less between these new fighters. They have a chance in BFM, the F-4E simply did not.
There are several players who are proficient enough to solo que & win while using the F-4E. Landing & leaving when it’s clear the match is a loss makes this a lot easier but isn’t necessary.
To stay on the topic of the Su-27, it is more than possible to just remain at a distance and fire R-27ER at enemies that are still low and slow. Just requires a bit of patience.
With the changes to multipath this last major the plan is a LOT more viable.
Guys the point is: for the META the su-27 isn’t that bad, the problem is that the fm is inaccurate and it would be nice to have an accurate one… Realism, right?
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Giving the Flankers (and Fulcrums for that matter) a more realistic FM won’t make them the ultimate power in the game; it wouldn’t even warrant making the SM 14.0 if the BRs were further decompressed.
Gimping planes this badly just because they have decent missiles only makes them unenjoyable and unbalances the game, especially in Sim. It made no sense whatsoever before Fox threes were added, and even less so now.
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Yea pretty much
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I get tired of hearing people complain solely about underperforming flight models though
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