Supermaneuverability, in fact, only the last generation of aircraft can practically do it, and I doubt if it is practiced. Maybe yes maybe no. It has its disadvantages - loss of speed, for example. But we are talking about whether the Su 27 is as you say - the best - and it is not. Not the best. Very good ? Maybe. But we keep talking about one thing, but one thing doesn’t make the whole plane, remember? It’s all about finding a compromise and that’s the beauty of it.
Sukhoi Su-27/30/33/35/37 Flanker series & Su-34 Fullback - History, Design, Performance & Dissection
This conversation is over until you do some real hard looking at the overall picture.
The F-22 & Su-57 is supermaneuverable. Air Superiority fighters of the 5th generation are supermaneuverable by default. The Chinese J-20B is now supermaneuverable with its TVC engines.
These aircraft all have design lineage that can be traced back to the Su-27.
Before anyone screeches “what about F-35”.
The F-35 is not supermaneuverable because it lacks the aerodynamic patterns we previously discussed & it’s not designed for Air Dominance & Air Supremacy.
The F-35 is a dedicated multirole aircraft & swing role capability. That is why it is called the Joint Strike Fighter. The F-16 can defeat a F-35 in a dogfight.
F-16 can also beat F-22 and Su 27 and Su 35 and also F-16 can lose to Phantom II F-4, so ? On paper it’s very nice, in rally it’s more complicated. But let’s talk about the Su 27 and its capabilities and limits.
rafale
That’s nice, but this will get us to the Fokker D.VIIF or Bleriot’s plane. I don’t see the contribution of the Su 27 so dramatically, every aircraft is based on something.
Why? it’s only done on paper right?
This conversation is over.
Yes, only when it starts off the training dead behind it. Training exercises are meant to demonstrate a common enemy’s tactics. Not a 1v1 of which aircraft is better like gamers think goes down.
The F-22 is still completely classified. They are not performing to the full capability BY LAW. That is why the F-22 sometimes leaves fuel tanks strapped to it to lessen the performance & degrade its stealth in training.
The Russians do not go out training with other nations performing the best to their ability either. But will use their aircraft to mimic the way US fighters fly to simulate the doctrine of the enemy, NATO. The ROF & specifics of these exercises such as weapon loadouts, fuel states are completely classified.
This is another common video gamer misconception & is simply propaganda that means noting in regard to either aircraft’s true capabilities.
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For the “purity” of the experiment, it was necessary to show the F-15A/S…because the Su-27 is a heavy fighter…In addition, these are Finnish modernized ones (I have already written about them here) with a Digital Electric control system …
It was not possible to find a similar angle (special shooting)…
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Of course you don’t see the contribution. You think only 4th generation fighters are capable of supermaneuvrability & think its only done on paper…
You also seriously think the F-18 has better control over the Su-27. Control as in what? in landing & taking off from a boat?
Ok sure. But then you have the Su-27K which still does that better and does not need a catapult to launch. That is how powerful these aircraft are over the F-18. Nothing about the F-18 can top the aerodynamic design of the Su-27. Nothing.
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@BBCRF does the latest MiG-29 not delete these engine vents? Do the latest Sukhoi models use them?
I believe the answer is no… @Ziggy1989
Funnily enough, your description of how or what these vents are used for is erroneous as well.
This is indeed the Su-27 topic, perhaps we can discuss the meaning of the various vents around the intake nacelles and what they do in order to rectify this misunderstanding.
Additionally, while the F/A-18 does not use the center of the body for additional lifting the same fashion as the F-14 or Su-27, instead it places the engines directly next to one another and has additional wing-body space on the side of the nacelles before the wings extend out. The aircraft has quite a lot of wing, a lower sweep angle… it was intended to (and does) have better handling at higher AoA than the Su-27 with the exception of momentary maneuvers such as the Cobra. It must be said though that such maneuvers are not reversible or ‘controlled’ in the same fashion as the F-18’s high alpha capabilities because once started they must be followed through.
Hi bro just a question and a half.
This entails the F-22, 35, J-20, Su-57 and KF-21 correct?
Though we obviously don’t truly know but the F-35A is not super maneuverable right?
Also for the second Q.
Isn’t Russias doctrine by heart in the 4th gen scene clearly to prioritize super maneuverability over anything compared to NATO doctrine which seems to be more bvr focused?
Just very curious to your take on these questions! Answer when you can bro! :D
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You are so uneducated & keep getting smacked around by me I am starting to feel bad.
These vents were so important that the Americans copied the design & implemented them in this fighter them in this fighter. The automatic opening & closing at angles of attack.
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Lol
Look up what these are for and try again
One of them are intakes (mig-29)… The other are not…
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Not the F-35 all evidence in its aerodynamic layout (though it’s got a vicious thrust) is capable. I believe I can find US pilots mentioning it too.
The KF-21 might as it is a dual engine setup with everything else, but no TVC that I am aware. I do not know what kind of thrust its working with or how quickly its max thrust & AB is engaged. Some aircraft have high thrust to weights but must slowly & judicially engage the throttle to max.
The General Electric F110-GE-400 have this issue in the Tomcat.
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They are called intake louvers. Get an education. Go to college, do something. Please.
He’s googling them right now as we speak…
The first one certainly does. The F-15 isn’t in the game because we’re talking about maneuverability and achieving AoA, that’s why there’s the Light Hornet and the Heavy Su 27, nothing but academic debate and a bit of childishness in there. If we continue with the F-15, it is also maneuverable in high AoA of course it is in a different league than the Sukhoi but still pretty good and in practice sufficient.
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The F-22 has fixed air inlets instead of a movable ramp, those are overpressure vents on the top of the aircraft. They are NOT intakes.
This is also self evident by the direction they face when open being towards the rear and not into the wind as such on the MiG-29.
Stop making stuff up.
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You mentioned the F-18 having better control above 24° AoA than the Su-27, have you read into the F-35? I’ve heard it has a soft limit of 55° that it can float around at and maintain. It’s done so at airshows fairly regularly.
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Yes, only the first version had them and they are only for the ground.
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They are open in very low speed flight iirc after takeoff as well, let’s not forget that… Certainly not modulated via AoA as claimed.
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Yes, the F-35 has excellent nose pointing and can do about 50 AoA, it is dangerous in a dogfight if the pilot uses it.
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