What has to do the chinese playerbase with singapure?
honestly i agree. controversial opinion, but i agree.
+1 japan
Poland +1, because upside down Poland with moon
Tree idea, any country that only has red and white in their flag join into one tree
+1 japan or israel
Edit: To my mind, it would be better if both Japan and Israel TTs could obtain some Singapore vehicles. The Japan TT is facing a shortage of light tanks and future Rank IX aircraft (unless the F15JSI joins the Japan TT,which is also a possible option, we may only see the Su-30MKM and Rafale from Indonesia, while the Gripen E purchased by Thailand has not yet been delivered), and the Israel TT also needs more vehicles (even if Greece and Cyprus will join the Israel Tree). Therefore, I think it would be great to add Singapore vehicles separately according to the needs of Japan TT and Israel TT.
It here🥹
Even though I still prefer nations like Chile to be an Israeli subtree. At this rate, I’d rather Singapore being in one TT as a subtree of Israel at the cost of Chile than Singapore being split up between several TT. Not helped that Singapore doesn’t really have a lot of good options. The only other two options i could think of is a subtree of the United Korean TT alongside the Philippines or as a subtree of a Australian/Australian-Canadian TT.
I feel like they could make a good sub tree for United Korea
Ah yes, the one thing Gaijin is known for
@RSS_Defender I am not quite sure when you removed the 2a7, but god am i happy you did it.
That did vex me to no end
Even though nobody has brought up the Tempest in this thread from what I can tell, I would like to share an unsourced overview of Centurion tanks in the SAF I found on the internet. It is completely up in the air whether you’d like to buy what is said or not, but I personally believe it, especially with all the other alleged witness testimonies I’ve read on Facebook while trying to dig up anything on this vehicle. Either way, I’d say it’s quite the interesting stuff.
Spoiler
Seems to be some speculation and misinformation on the Tempest in this thread. Its been many moons now, but I will answer your questions to the best of my ability.
Firstly, yes, they exists; yes, I have seen them, yes; there are pictures of them. But you will not see the pictures ever published (more on this later).
The tanks were acquired thru India, at that time, we were buying lots of used armoured stuff from them, including AMX-13s. By the way, not all Indian Centurions had the 20pdrs, some were already equipped with L7 105mm as far back as 1965. There was a permanent detachment of 6 tanks in Taiwan (along with a detachment of AMX-13s), at the Singapore armour base there, at Hukou. Those people who say they have never seen the Tempest in Taiwan dispite training there, are probably from the Infantry. Those people tend to train in the south at Koashiung, and usually have no interaction with the armour people in Hukou.
The tanks were modified to IDF Sho’t standard, with the Teledyne Continental AVDS diesel engine and Allison transmission. As well, as 105mm gun, improved FCS (ballistic computer and range finder). Ah, u ask, why don;t the Singapore army just buy the modified ones directly from the IDF. I believe at the time, the IDF SHo’ts were still so effective, that each was treated like a national treasure, and hence could not be sold. They were painted in the original Indian grey (not jungle camo as the SAF AMXs were). The tanks there are usually used only for SAF Tempest conversion courses, which are only offered to regular SAF officers and NCOs. Regular officers are flown out there for the courses, whereby they will also bring along the Tempest trained maintenance crews. AFter the training, the tanks are maintained, cleaned, and put back into storage in an open tank shed. There is altogether about 2 reserved battalion of Tempests. The number of Tempest conversion courses is fairly large, and hence its an overkill to crew just the supposedly 12 Tempests that everyone thinks there is. The balance is kept in an secret location in SIngapore. Don’t ask me, or I have to kill you. LOL.
There is no ERA for the tanks. AT least there wasn’t by the the time I left the SAF. There was no talk of it either. APFSDS rounds came later, and of course supplied by IMI. Some people on this thread mentioned the Taiwanese hated the tanks as they broke water pipes went they traveled. This can’t be correct. The Tempest, as with all SAF tanks are never on any public roads, and the armour camp at Hukou is pretty isolated from heavy residential areas. The camp leads straight into the training area, so there is no transit through public roads. Having said that, this tank is one big mother. When parked next to a AMX, it totally dwarfs its. Imagine a Cadillac Escalade next to a Suzuki Swift. It even dwarfs the ROC’s M-41s, M-24, and M48s. U knew when this thing was coming down the road.
As for why its in Taiwan and not back in Singapore. The reason is that there just is not the training space for this tank. And more importantly, there is no butt in singapore that can take a 105mm round. In the event of a conflict, the tanks that are stored in Singapore will be the ones that will go into battle, not these ones in ROC. There are however contingency plans for the SAF to ship these back if there appears to be a war between China and Taiwan. Another reason for the secrecy was because the tank was such an overkill compared to the type of armour our likely enemies were operating. To openly disclose that we have the Tempest, when the potential enemy has a 90mm Scorpion, Sibmas, and Condor AFVs is to invite a diplomatic row and an arms race. This is another reason why ERA was not added. The SAF knew this was a stop gap tank anyway, until a newer generation was purchased. Therefore, no need to spend on too much upgrades. Its only later went the neighbours went PT-91 that the SAF was open in purchasing the Leo 2.
Going back to the pictures. IIRC, every Tempest conversion course has a group pic with the Tempest in the background. But you will never see these pics. LOL.
Singapore Centurion ‘Tempest’ - Page 2 - AFV Forum - tanknet.org
For something a little more concrete, I did also find a paper written by an Assistant Professor at the Nanyang Technological University that does mention Singapore owning 100 Centurions, with some decent sources cited for that claim. No additional information can be found in said paper however.
Wayback Machine
In addition, I also came across a rumor on Reddit that some drone footage of a Centurion being uses as a target for Spike testing was posted on the official MINDEF YouTube account around a decade ago. I tried to skim through videos from that timeframe with no luck, and I honestly wouldn’t put it past the SAF to delete something like that anyways.
Spoiler
