So why isn’t the Tiger E like 7.0 with its high filler APHE?
Because the Tiger E doesn’t have M36 level of mobility, nor a fast turret traverse compared to other US tanks.
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So? It has over pressure. It should be at least 7.3.
Lets be real, the M36 pays for its firepower and mobility by getting overpressured if anything HE or HEAT hits it. The PT-76, for an example, is basically the natural predator against M36s because of its 5 second reload HEAT.
The M18 at least has the whole ‘no armor best armor’ thing going for it while also being faster to boot. The only thing it cant do is snipe, but neither can the M36.
What would actually make the M36 uptier material is if the solid AP can penetrate the hordes of Panthers, Jagdpanthers and the Panzer IV/V. Finally, a tank that can comfortably engage German medium tanks from beyond point blank.
Except that the M36 has a .50cal which turns the PT-76 into swiss cheese, even from a turret down position. But sure, the PT-76 is pretty good at killing open top vehicles.
It’s probably somewhat underrated with the stabilizer, reload rate and HEAT-FS that is decent for dealing with all sorts of targets.
Nah, the M18 is in a spot were everything kills it easily. The armor just stops 7.7mm but nothing more.
And in most cases APHE will fuze on the M18. I rarely had to shoot a M18 more than once to kill it.
No one is going to use the solid shot, as long as APHE is so effective or even overpressures.
It will be kinda like APCR, where you maybe carry a few in case you spot a Panther and have time to switch ammo.
It makes no sense to think that a round that can pen a Panther but is worse against anything else is going to make the vehicle so much better.
I killed a T-34-85 with M82 today even though I could only see like 10cm of his turret. With T33 I might have not even knocked out the gun with such shot.
So a vehicle that beats Germany at mobility but can also negate their range advantage?
It would just turn the M36 into a more effective vehicle than the Panther.
The only thing the Panther would offer is frontal armor and not getting overpressured from HEAT.
While the M36 would be better at knocking out vehicles with firepower alone, not to mention the mobility.
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“I want to uptier US vehicles just because”- KillaKiwi. How adding low pen/high damage shell(ever less pen than pervious) for skilled/or risky players must send it up?
The difference in penetration hardly makes a difference for the ability to kill vehicles by just having the round enter anywhere.
No one uses the Pzgr. 39 on the Tiger anymore, because it’s completely pointless compared to a round that kills regardless where you penetrate the enemy.
Also, I don’t want to uptier US vehicles but that’s just what is going to happen when they get better at killing others.
If APHE overpressure gets adjusted, and even, god fobid, APHE gets nerfed to realistic levels, then no one is going to use the M82 with more filler but less performance.
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Not anywhere. Tog backasswards will survive if engine hit, IS probally too. Tortoise survived cupola hit from Tiger.
It will have much less points to penetrate, that balances it.
Not really because penetration is overrated. There are hardly any instances where a bit more penetration would result in a vehicle getting much better compared to an increase in damage.
Because quick kills mean that you don’t have to bother with a target anymore.
The threat is neutralized and you don’t have to spent more time that you could use to kill another target.
And how exactly would that make a difference with less APHE filler? The result is the same. Both knock out the engine.
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High HE won’t kill anywhere. I said it. Even 700gr APHE from Jagtiger can kill only one crewmember, i have video.
Around 20mm is not a bit. IS-2-43 LFP can became invicible, LFP of Jagpanther. And some more.
So the Jumbo 76 can go to 5.7 with the Jumbo 75.
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IS-2 (1944) LFP would be invincible in the areas where it has additional track armor, yes, but Jagdpanther/Panther LFP would not.
Earlier Panthers (Panther D, Panther A) have 60 mm at 56º which provides 143 mm of effective protection against 90 mm APCBC. After running some numbers and estimates to obtain the penetration 813 m/s M82 with 199 grams of Explosive D at distances of 10, 100, 500, 1000, 1500 and 2000 meters, it would still have around 144 mm of penetration at 1000 meters.
Jagdpanthers have weaker LFPs than those earlier Panthers, so they would most definitely not be immune to early M82. In fact, I’m pretty sure the Jagdpanther LFP is currently overperforming even, as it is roughly 55 mm thick at 55º, when in reality I am fairly certain it should be 50 mm at 55º like the Panther G.
Jagdpanther LFP
An angle of 60º provides a LoS thickness value that is exactly double that of the actual thickness of the armor. Hence the Jagdpanther’s LFP is roughly 55 mm thick.
Even if the armor thickness is stated to be 50 mm, the actual thickness value of variable thickness armor depends entirely on the 3D model of the armor itself. So while it might be stated to be 50 mm, the actual thickness of the 3D model is 55 mm.
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Do you have information about german 88mm shells? I am absolutely sure that PzGr 39 muzzle velocity should be around 800m/s.
Apparently it was for the 88mm FlaK 37 but for the Tiger it was only 773m/s.
At least that was it says in the book
Encyclopedia of German Tanks of World War Two: A Complete Illustrated Directory of German Battle Tanks, Armoured Cars, Self-propelled Guns, and Semi-tracked Vehicles, 1933-1945
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In “tigerbefel” feedforward for PzGr 39 lesser than for SpGr, how it’s possible if SpGr is faster than PzGr 39 according to game and that book?
Look
Yes. Very odd. But they also put the Panzergranate 39 and 40 in the same category.
Seems like a mistake.
The first row is probably accurate for Pzgr. 40 and the second row for Sprenggranate and Pzgr. 39.
The 88mm Pzgr., Pzgr. 39 and Sprenggranate use the same amount of propellant while the Sprenggranate weighs 9kg compared to the 10.2kg of the Pzgr. 39 and the 9.5kg of the old Pzgr.
So there’s no way that the AP rounds would be faster than the HE round.
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Tiger! : the tiger tank : a British view
In this book MV also mentioned as 800m/s.
APCR had big velocity draw during flight, it’s normal to have same foreforward
Not sure. It’s the same shape but lighter. Sure it would lose some velocity quicker but not that much of a difference.
According to the ammunition manual of the 8,8cm KwK 36:
Schießregel für 8,8 cm Pzgr. 40:
Das Ziel ist zielaufliegend anzurichten auf alle Kampfentfernungen bis 500 m
mit dem entsprechenden Metermarken der Pzgr. 39
Auf Entfernungen von 600 – 1000 m sind jeweils 100 m, von 1100 bis 1500 m
jeweils 200 m abzubrechen.
- Beispiel: Gemessene Entfernung 400 m. Das Ziel ist mit der
400-m-Marke der Pzgr. 39 anzurichten.- Beispiel: Gemessene Entfernung 1200 m. Das Ziel ist mit der
1000-m-Marke anzurichten
So the trajectory is flatter and therefore the shell hits faster.
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