Idk if a better Engine makes 8.7 valid…everything else is still crap
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Yeah, they probably do. but that would be the best starting point
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I guess that makes sense.
In my experience, the 120mm APDS performs quite well. It’s not the best shell at the BR but it gets the job done without issues. Mobility on the other hand is certainly the Achilles heel of the Chieftains. Like someone else already said, the Mk. 3, with especially awful mobility, could go to 8.3 without stirring up problems.
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Meanwhile the T-62…
Could probably drop the Mk.3 and 62 to 8.3. But further compressing the 7.3 to 8.3 bracket isn’t a great idea either.
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At the end of the day, it comes to the problem that Gaijin isn’t adding a new top BR.
There are more than a handful of vehicles that need more than a full BR apart.
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If lowering the BR of any vehicle would cause the BR range, below that vehicle, to be more compressed, then, logically, no vehicles should ever have their BR lowered, as compression is bad.
But simply thinking that it’s compression when, in fact, the Chieftains going to 8.3 could be considered fair, isn’t right.
If the BR range of 7.3 to 8.3 should be able to meet Chieftains (based on how well they can perform against Chieftains), then I see no compression, but balancing instead.
The F-86s and MiG-15s moving down from 8.3 to 8.0 quite literally compressed the 7.0 to 8.0 BR range, as I believe nobody thinks they should be fighting WW2 / post-WW2 jets, and yet F-86s and MiG-15s are said to be overBR’d.
In the F-86’s case or MiG-15’s, the best way to deal with this issue is just to increase the max BR range and move everything to a higher BR, like what you’re saying in this case (I assume).
You could do the same with the Chieftain, but moving it to a lower BR, while still being fair to fight against, is the easiest way to balance, if you know what I mean.
Absolutely agree. Especially considering the British 8.3 lineup is SORELY lacking in one somewhat armored MBT. I’m personally about to research the Falcon and it feels painful that the only MBT you have at 8.3 is the Vickers.
The Vickers is great, and the British 8.3 lineup is great - but it lacks armor. And the Chieftain Mk.3 would perfectly round out British 8.3. It really feels like malice when they refuse to implement such simple QoL.
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Vickers Mk.1 and Mk.3 are very capable vehicles. I prefer the Mk.1 as it gets the 5s reload, but either of them excel at their respective areas.
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Incredible armour and an insanely powerful gun
The Mk 3 is a bit slower, sure, but it can entrench and the dozer passively adds something like 80mm RHAe to the vulnerable lower plate. At 8.3, the Cheiftans would be fighting IS-3s, and 7.7 heavies in only a partial downtier.
Use them in hull downs, use them at range, or go brawling with a battle buddy or two. Just don’t expect to be able to flank, keep your head on a swivel, and don’t leave yourself alone and exposed. Just like you would on a lower tier heavy tank.
Your goal should be not to hunt other tanks (that’s the job of something faster like a Vickers) but to contest space and deny the enemy area to operate. Either by being a hull-down sniping monster or forcing the enemy to face you front-on at close range and high pressure where you can shrug off their fire while one-shotting with your enormous cannon.
Literally everything stronger than APHE can pen the turret front near the gunner’s optics. HEAT, even 90mm HEAT that’s common at 7.3, can pen the majority of turret. And all APHE bar M82 shot can pen the LFP too, dozerblade or not.
That last part matters quite a bit considering how few maps are left that actually cater to a hulldown playstyle. Going brawling with the Chieftains is a bit of a non-starter considering just how weak your hull is. Not to mention the longer than average reload and slow reactive mobility.
A reminder that the Cheiftains share the same BR with the T-55-AM1, which crush them on on armor without giving up their mobility to do so.
Both Chieftains and the other weak 8.7s (T-62, Object 435, RISE (P), etc) either need to move down, or the stronger 8.7s need to move up.
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The T-55-AM1 also gets a laser rangefinder (long-range accuracy is kinda the Chieftain’s Gimmick) and APFSDS on a marginally lower calibre gun…
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I don’t really agree
I think they are absolute beasts at 8.7. 120mm at that br is really good and APDS gets bad rep too much its very good and 7kg shell just destroys.
Down-tier like here it absolutely smacks everything without any skill needed.
At 8.3 I would Imagine it would be death incarnate with experienced player.
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20mm is quite a big difference.
I do think the T-55’s are very strong at 8.7, some of, if not THE best 8.7’s, but their guns aren’t 9.0 material. 8.7 is a victim of compression.
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I see what you mean.
If I were to think of an 8.3 vehicle similar to it, I would say the M60A1 (AOS) performs similarly against 7.3s (Although having a 105mm instead of 120mm, it gets a 6.7s reload instead of the 7.5s reload, with arguably better hull armour for the cost of the APHE cupola weakspot).
I don’t think you realize just how superior the Chieftain’s APDS is compared to the T-55AM-1’s short-rod APFSDS.
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From what I can remember, the 120mm APDS that the Chieftain has doesn’t shatter nearly as much as the early APDS like with the Centurion Mk.3 and such.
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Not just that, it essentially doesn’t shatter at all. It’s also basically modeled as late APFSDS.
It’s extremely powerful and it spalls a lot more than earlier APDS, even large ones such as the Conqueror. For all intents and purposes - it can be seen as long-rod APFSDS.
I think the only shell more potent at 8.7 may be the PTZ89’s 120mm APFSDS, although I’m not sure if there’s anything else. Regardless - it’s easily one of the best shells available at BR 8.7.
I’m personally grinding Britain precisely because of the Chieftains and Falcon - but it sure would be nice if the Chieftain Mk.3 were 8.3 for the lineup…
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If it were only for the lineup, I would have to disagree… as BRs for vehicles for the sake of convenience is not fair. They should be judged by their merits instead, as you might agree.
I have mixed feelings about the Chieftain going to 8.3, because like @D00MBrInG3r777 said, it seems to perform really well in downtiers (like expected for any fully downtiered vehicle), but more importantly the gun and armour is fairly good (although not the best for 8.7).
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Of course, but I do believe convenience should have at least a slight influence.
The biggest problem for the Chieftains is easily their mobility, and the Mk.3 gets a strictly weaker engine, further exacerbating the issue.
It is obviously worse than the Mk.5. So when they’re the same BR, it feels like the Mk.3 strictly exists as a back-up to the Mk.5.
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