Following the Roadmap: grouping vehicles, rank changes, and improvements to premium vehicles

[Billygoatunicorn]

This is honestly a pretty garbage work on the foldering. People want similar vehicles to be foldered, so they don’t have to research the same vehicle multiple times. This though is simply a hodge podge of folders for vehicles that were next to each other in the tech tree, instead of a more sensical foldering of similar vehicles, so that you’ll actually be able to easily know where each vehicle is foldered. If I’m looking for where you put the M48 Super, I’m going to look next to the M48A2 G, not the KPZ-70, a vehicle it has nothing in common with it. This is just going to be annoying and confusing. Just folder the many many very alike vehicles instead, because then we’ll know what catagory to look under. What you have done here is listen to how much people have been telling you to folder vehicles so we don’t have to research essentially the same vehicle over and over so we don’t waste our RP, and all you heard was “Folder vehicles, got it” so now next to nothing changed of significance. I could easily draw up a much more cohesive tech tree of all of these by myself in a week.

It’s quite frustrating too because this is the change that made me consider getting back into war thunder for, but the folders are so horrendous, that I’d rather them not be changed at all. But if you take this as an opportunity to back down and do nothing while pretending that you tried, everyone will see right through it. If this is coming off as aggressive feedback, sorry, but this change upsets me how horrible you could make it.

[toddwagn]

Will there be any changes to the number of vehicles needed to unlock different ranks for any of the tech trees?

I haven’t seen this disclosed, but it could have a major impact. Based on the proposed new tech trees some would have to change just because there aren’t enough vehicles (e.g., Sweden Air rank 4).

[列克星敦的老公]

Is there any chance for us to continue research or buy the vehicles which im researching now after the update? I have some vehicles researching which will be moved to other locations after the update. I have no idea if I can complete the research and purchase in time before the update.

[FrostyCptn]

hi everyone! do we know anything about the rp after the grouping? I mean if a tank now costs 220,000 rp and after the update goes to 110,000 and i have already researched 210,000 rp for this tank, after the update what will happen? I will get the tank and the rest 100,000 rp will become free to use in the next tank, will it consume all of the rp and give me the tank or will it make me research the rest 10,000 to get it because i started it before the update? Or the worst case scenario, erase all of the rp i have gained and restart it?

[yairobe]

Propably it go to “Free EXP” which you can convert from GE :)

[yairobe]

Good job men :) I wish that Gaijin read it and hear you and us :)

[Kanelikainalo-psn]

Would be nice if it worked like the current new vehicle implementation, so we have few weeks to research and buy the moved vehicles.

[LiteralStone-psn]

Which no one uses.

[yairobe]

On other game with tanks there is some points for free use, but gajin try monetize evrything. It be pretty good when you can use free exp for free and research parts of stock machines.

[Sarkelias]

Hey guys - I don’t know if it’s too late to add feedback to this, but I was revisiting the US 8.7-9.0 range, and it occurred to me that while you’re moving things around, you should really put the FJ-4B back to the “fighter” classification, and maybe move it above the F3H. As an attacker, with Skyhawks existing at the same BR with vastly superior loadouts, there’s no reason to use it - whereas as a fighter-bomber, it would provide a very useful niche in ground battles around its BR. Thanks for your time. I’m excited for the changes.

[GameBoiBoi]

@Stona_WT

We’ll be open with you: War Thunder’s research trees have not gone through much reshaping over the years — we add vehicles in logical positions within the tree, group a limited number of similar vehicles, and make research point adjustments down the line where necessary. Because of this, the planned grouping of vehicles within research trees can be considered one of the largest progression changes that we’ve made since the game’s inception, and will affect almost all players.

When you say grouping similar vehicles, did you mean vehicles with similar playstyles or placing variants of a vehicle into a foldered group?

Some of the vehicles that were grouped on the dev server have significantly different playstyles with the only similarity between them being that they are of the same vehicle class.

Is the plan going forward to stop grouping vehicles by variants into vehicle folders and to group vehicles with similar br in the same tech line?

[vaultraider]

While I am pleased to see the reduction of RP for foldered vehicles, I am concerned with what actually is being gained by the players?

What point is there when the amount reduced will be recuperated from the increased costs of the modifications since they are then treated as ‘end of the line’ vehicles?

If for instance lets take a rank VIII vehicle that costs normally 410k RP, is reduced to 200k RP being foldered with another vehicle, that’s great… until you notice that instead of normally being ~315k for researching modifications on the vehicle, it is now ~525k RP for modifications since it is now treated as an end of the line vehicle…

As seen, this means that the amount reduced for the vehicle being in the folder was then gained back (sometimes even with interest) from the modifications… so you end up having to earn more RP to spade the vehicle than you normally would have if you had unlocked it through current methods.

Now, obviously there are some differences, but still in the overall scheme, it seems like the folder of these vehicles will be more detrimental to overall research than what we have now… So in a sense, with the new foldered vehicle changes, we are most likely going to be working even harder to spade vehicles…

Granted, YES… you will be able to UNLOCK the vehicle for use faster and ALSO be able to progress through the tree faster… but as we all know, the stock vehicle… is not ideal as the true performance is gained through unlocking the modifications to better perform against adversaries. So if your intention is to use the foldered vehicle, please be advised about this.

So… how do we go forward with this type of information… As far as I know this is how it is going to be upon release of this new change… Is this the intention? Obviously this will also coincide with SL costs, whereas in the proposed changes will cost you MORE to spade a vehicle both RP and SL than what we have now.

If I am completely wrong in my understanding, please feel free to provide input, but for now this is how I see it as the changes will be in place.

[TigerF67]

I have a suggestion to make about the Swedish airtree. In the A28B - Vampire FB 52A folder, the A28B should be the “main” (first) vehicle in the folder as it is in the Swedish tech tree after all. Grouping them makes sense though, but the A28 should be first in that group.

[orlo]

Concerning aircrafts in Ranks 1 to 4

Why don’t you just quit on degrading ranks of aircrafts and just lift the limits on buying 5/5, 6/6 aircrafts in R1 to R4.
People will go much faster through the tech tree.

Or if you insist on downgrading them (i.e Rank 3 to Rank 2), why not do the same with other aircrafts from the same “War period”. Like, if La-5F / F6F-5 “go down” why not Bf-109 F-4. Do you get the idea?

[Warpig]

I hope we get to see a finalized version of this a good week before release.

[P-aladin]

Dear Gaijin,

I am very pleased regarding the new tech tree update that you announced for September 2023. You were asking for feedback, so here it comes (only for Air Arcade):

a) please check the foldering of planes and cosnider the families a bit more: US tree → F4U and F6F do not at all belong in the same folder. I am sure there are many more of these examples

b) when foldering planes, please consider historical sequence. If possible, have earlier planes earlier in the tech tree than the newer ones. This might not be easy and possible everywhere, but there are too many examples where the sequence is not considered. While you might be less interested in the lower tiers, this is where it seems complicated and where you could please pay special attention

c) Overall, please put most effort in the delicate line between Tier2 and Tier3. Since this is the defining Tier for daily tasks and also for the battle pass, please be very careful here.

d) at the moment you seem to define that BR 3,7 is sometimes Tier3 and sometimes Tier2. I would like to suggest to put this decisive BR to 3,3. This would give more players the chance to participate in daily tasks and in the battle pass → which will earn you more money

e) with BR3,7 as the general line for tier3, you cut off nearly all torpedo bombers and agile light bombers from usage in daily tasks and battle pass. For example the US SB2Cs are gone out of tier3 and the only light bombers left are the Japanese B7A2s … I don’t even dare hoping for JU87s in tier 3 :)

f) with BR3,7 as the general tier 3 line you also cut off many strike aircraft, which also affects the battle pass and daily tasks

g) please pay attention to the KI-61 (at BR3,7) and Ki-44 (at BR3,7): while the US and Japanese ones are going to be in rank2, the same plane and same BR for China will be in rank3 → this seems utterly unfair and not reasonable. Please review this especially. In my opinion and many others, these planes are very strong and belong into rank3

h) as you can see, i don’t care for the other ranks and BRs as this area (BR3,7 and BR3,3) is the most important when talking about daily tasks ans battle pass → here is where you earn some money. So please put BR3,3 as the defining BR and put all 3,7 in rank3.

i) as a last comment: please check the german tech tree for fighters in general. There is a huge gaping hole between BR3,3 and BR4,0 → there is literally only 1 FW190 at BR3,7. the rest is a huge black hole. No fighters at 3,3 and 4,0 and only 1 at BR3,7. No other country has this kind of gap. :)

Thanks for forwarding this to the right people in you team and considering my thoughts. Looking very much forward to the upcoming changes.

[toddwagn]

I would also like to have detailed description of the research / purchase mechanics for relocated vehicles. Currently on the dev server, I can purchase the USSR La-5FN having previously purchased the La-5F (foldered behind the La-5), but not the La-5 that precedes it in the new tree. However in the US tree, where I had researched but not purchased everything from the P-47D-5 through the P-51H, none of the previously researched vehicles can be purchased as they were foldered and the main line must be researched and purchased first. The conditions due to the relocation does make different relationships between the vehicles in these two cases, but it would be good to know what the requirements will be so that we can make decisions about what to research and purchase prior to the update.

[Saab_Enjoyer]

Hi, i have a question to this grouping.

I have F-16 ADF, and after vehicle grouping this F-16 will be moved into “folder” where is F-16A (with bombs) is first

And also i have IS-2 №321 from 9th May event, and i don’t have the regular IS-2, so without researching IS-2 i cannot go further in this tree

Can i after F-16 ADF start research F-16C without researching F-16A in upcoming patch?

[Huntershark8]

The M4A1 76 at 4.7 being the first rank 3 tank that’s not an SPAA, is so disheartening for events and dailies.

[wolfwhite2]

Notice how they didn’t move the 75 Shermans down to rank II in other nations. Some at lower BRs they remain at rank III. Same with the Helldivers. P-51C goes to rank II in US tree, but that’s okay just buy the premium in another nation and you get a rank III version.