Really didn’t expect I have to say this, but please do not make fun of other users and whatnot, and just stay on-topic, as consequences might come out of this. Thanks :)
4 Likes
i wonder if they will ever integrate the AIM-174 onto an F-15E or EX, would be amazing
Being availible 10 years earlier, fitting an AMRAAM mount without major weight discrepancies/restrictions (compared with AIM-174), smaller as you said, lighter than 174, potential for twin carriage.
AIM-260 is going to be available later, as you said a smaller NEZ, but also it could be for some countries more favourable to deal with Europe than the US.
But the main takeaway is that Meteor is 10 years older than these are now without any block improvements such as AMRAAM.
You could say the same thing about AIM-9X as we’ve discussed I think, other than cost, what does it bring over ASRAAM and IRIS-T (that we know about of course).
I imagine -120<Meteor<-260 which will be < or = Meteor MLU and wouldn’t really seriously consider AIM-174 for anyone but the USN. But who knows. Europe will hopefully prioritise European armaments for ‘strategic autonomy’ as the French like to call it.
1 Like
i think AIM-260 will have better electronics than Meteor MLU unless meteor is getting an AESA seeker
Meteor MLU is pursuing an AESA seeker and supposedly an improved propulsion system. That seems to be the primary point of it.
There is a rumour with no proper basis but existing, that the JNAAM was cancelled (JNAAM was going to use an AAM-4B AESA seeker on Meteor body) as it was Veto’d by France who have the primary rights to the Meteor’s seeker (given its a larger MICA seeker), as the JNAAM would have threatened France’s interests in Meteor MLU which all but confirms an AESA seeker if true. As I said its a rumour I saw from one of the prominent Twitter defence analysts so could be a load of nonsense.
1 Like
Ah ok. I think it will be interesting to see how the 2 compare in the future when more is known
Don’t think we will see a true comparison within our lifetimes, at least not whilst we are relatively sane (at least as sane as WT players get).
Well this is true, but if a war happens and 260 are used I think by the end the public learns more about the system no?
Through combat news, people get more information on the weapons used, what they can and cannot do
It doesn’t fly at 50 AoA. The real limit of a normal turn is 25-27. Although even this may be overstated, but I suspect there are development crutches here. As far as I remember, the flight model hasn’t changed since the end of Dev. No idea where you got 50 from. At 50 it already falls into a flip.
I just spent 15 minutes specifically trying to get it to 50 degrees. The most it can do is get to 40-45. And even then, it doesn’t fly effectively there, it goes into a huge air brake mode. It’s very difficult to call it a “turn”.
I won’t look for confirmation because it will take time and it’s not worth it, but as far as I remember you said that he “pushed” too much overload. How can he be underperforming in this?
This is correct. The Meteor has a derivative of MICA seeker and the Meteor MLU will have a derivative of MICA NG-EM seeker which is already confirmed to be AESA.
1 Like
do you know anything about the cost per unit for a MICA NG EM?
i think the AIM-120D-3 may be the most cost effective ARH missile on the market but need to know prices of modern counterparts/competition, couldnt find anything from a google search on unit cost for MICA EM NG. but for regular mica EM, it was 1.2 million euro in 2000, which converts to $2.33 million in 2024 dollars
my current list is
#1 AIM-120D-3, $1-1.1 million, 160-180km range with great electronics
#2 Meteor, about $3 million, 200+km range, great electronics, excellent performance throughout flight
#3 PL-15, price unknown but probably decent, 200km range, great electronics (AESA seeker!)
#4 onwards idk
with price of MICA vs its performance i think itll be towards bottom of list
The aircraft should not hover at 50 degrees and still have roll control and exhibit zero departure symptoms. Not possible. There is a reason extreme low speed flight demonstrations where planes hover over crowds are impressive and only done by one or two modern fighters. Hint hint, both are Russian, use TVC, and are much better suited for high alpha flight.
Tech mod stated it should handle ‘X’ G-forces in certain conditions, I tested that and when I replied I had shown that it was ripping in less G force than the tech moderator had announced it should thus it was underperforming. Then I watched as there was a 100 comment conversation on something totally pointless or boringly irrelevant like comparison to other nations CAS loadouts or something and no one cared.
Then I announce that it is overperforming in some way and suddenly I’m bombarded by insults again. Hilarious.
The US will always have the most cost effective missile on the market because the production capacity, number of missiles produced, technical performance is all first in its’ class.
I think you’d be surprised how efficiently they can make some quality products.
1 Like
idk, i mean 2.33 MILLION for a standard MICA-EM, not even the next gen one
France in 2024 ordered 700 missiles for an average per missile cost of 1.4 million Euros each. ($1.45 million USD).
The 2+ million figure is quoted from India’s purchase which included spare motors, interchangeable seekers, etc to allow for longer sustainment and shelf life.
4 Likes
oh ok, that isn’t as bad
yup that’s most likely what is going to happen
MICA NG should enter service this year.
I really hope they also derivate its AESA seeker for Aster / Sea Viper
note that this is 700M € for 500 MICA NG, not the basic MICA (as you specified : 1.4M € per missile)
1 Like
The price varies strongly across project partners of the Meteor missile, ordered numbers and date of purchase:
Germany: ~900.000 € (520 missiles)
Italy: ~975.000 € (400 missiles)
UK: ~1.000.000 £ (400 missiles)
So, for project partners with missile orders in the hundreds, the Meteor is cheaper than the AIM-120D.
For non-project partners (like Brazil) it’s much more expensive (~2.000.000 €) per missile (100 ordered).
4 Likes
Like this?
https://community.gaijin.net/issues/p/warthunder/i/K6UV3Y1s6GAk
There was another report on this that was later marked as fixed, but seems that the underlying issue is still there and this bug comes back up sometimes.
yep, like this