Yeah, being back in a Phantom when everyone else is in Gen 4 just doesnt sound fun. Im a Britain main, so I want the British equivlanet Typhoon and our prospects are even worse. Best we can hope for is the Sea harrier. I see rough times ahead until they finally give us the Typhoon to level the playing field
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Dont forget that there is the normal Aim 9Li that is comparable to early Aim9M
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Eurofighter matches or exceeds the F-16 in all flight regimes, likely has a better radar and countermeasures, and is both quicker to accelerate, and faster climbing than both, all while being able to carry more weapons
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Personally, I think Eurofighter Typhoon Tranche 1 better F-16C Block 50/52 and MiG-29SMT (9-19) especially avionics and radar
I guess maybe Eurofighter Typhoon DA5 equivalent F-16C Block 50, MiG-29SMT (9-19), Eurofighter Typhoon FA.2 (UK), EF-2000 Typhoon DA7 (Italy) and Chengdu J-10A (PLAAF)/J-10AH (PLANAF)
You guess gajin consider AIM-9Li & AIM-9Li/1 this quarter (Q4) ?
The Aim-9L(I) and the AIM-9L(I)-1 are really similar to the AIM-9M seeker wise.
The 9L(I) incorpore an IRCCM module directly into the GCS, resulting in enhanced countermeasures and an upgraded seeker system. The AIM-9L(I)-1, which further enhances the 9L(I)GCS and is considered to be operationally equivalent to the originally “US-only” AIM-9M missile.
The different AIM-9M version are these:
The WGU-4A/B (AIM-9M-1/2/3 GCS) has flare rejection capabilities that don’t involve suspending tracking.
The WGU-4D/B (AIM-9M-6/7 GCS) then added improved guidance during flare detection, and the WGU-4E/B (AIM-9M-8/9/10 GCS) expanded the IRCM detection circuitry to improve capabilities against tactical IRCM.
So from what we can expect is the 9L(I) to be similar to the AIM-9M-6/7 while the 9L(I)-1 to be similar to the AIM-9M-8/9/10.
The IRCCM is the same kind: suspended tracking.
Motor wise, they didn’t change the motor over the 9L so it’s still a smoky motor.
Late blocks of the AIM-9L received the reduced smoke motor prior the the AIM-9M entering service iirc.
Well ty for the info, didn’t know that
As usual, far too late. Its simply not interesting nor exciting to get such an old airframe, when everyone else gets shiny toys like F-15/16/18. Will be similar as the F-4F early and F-4F P/R, they they were obsolete from the start. Maybe some mods might ask what Gajin’s issue is with Luftwaffe Phantoms. Never understood why Germany couldn’t have gotten the F-4F together with the other Phantom nations. For the Starfighter and Mig-21 it wasn’t an issue.
This currently applies for the recent F-16 addition as well. I don’t see why it shouldn’t be possible that non-US nations might get a new meta jet and US is back in the bus for one or two patches. There’s no law that always US need to have the best jet and other just have be behind.
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now if only we actualy would have gotten the 9Li at the same time as the 9M, i dont know who all would all get it from the britains but at least the Tornado would benefit from it since they dont wanna give it the current F4F at all
the 9M in game is an early one afaik. the 9L/I(-1) is more like the M-6/7 and M-8/9
and to answer your earlier question, it would still be overpowered in its flight performance but absolutely neutered in weapons.
They question is what matters more in Air RB. I’m not sure…is it the fligh performance or the suspended weaponry?
Whats better in ARB… A great airframe with just meh missiles or an old, outdated airframe with op missiles?
In my experience. Whether its ARB or ASB. Guns still play a major role in deciding the outcome of fights and even when missiles are brought to bear. Rear aspect shots are still important. Tornado F3 by all accounts has comparable weapons to that found on the F-16 or Mig-29, but sits multiple stops lower because its a bus that cannot turn even slightly.
So I’d personally take a great airframe with very limited weapons any day of the week because a good airframe can always put guns on target and evade incoming fire, but a bad airframe with great weapons is going to have a hard time defending itself and people will just moan about “OP” weapons and they’ll be nerfed to the point of almost uselessness (looking at SRAAM here)
I think that depends quite a bit tbh, and I think the primary deciding factor is how reliable the missiles are at a set point in time.
ATM, missiles feels atrocious, particularly the radar guided ones. Not only are they subject to a comicly idiotic level of multipath which makes hitting an AFK target sub 100m literally impossible, nvm a maneuvering target near any sort of ground clutter, I cant even be confident they’ll hit a head on target at sub 10km anymore.
IR missiles were also substantially less dependent back when Gaijin suddenly nerfed their flare resistance across the board in the past.
As long as missiles remain as terribly unreliable as they are, flight performance will remain a major factor of gameplay, particularly when there are so many ways to completely invalidate their use, such as the multipath hypercrutch.
What are you talking about? You know that Germany has always been behind other nations in terms of aircraft and tech introduction, right?
Germany got its first F-4 over a year after everyone else(including Britain), and they got it as an event vehicle first, followed by gaijin giving them the worst top tier (at the time) phantom in-game the next update, which not only has HALF the missile load of other F-4’s (literally the F-4’s “biggest advantage” at the time), but also didnt have its historical AIM-9L’s (which is STILL doesn’t have). They also got their MiG-21bis over a year late and AFTER it stopped being meta, they got their MiG-23MF late and as an event vehicle, they got their MiG-23MLA late, they got their MiG-29 late, Su-22’s late, and their Tornado’s are gutted.
Gaijin downright hates Germany, and they’ve proven it even more so with german ground, with their first Rank 7 vehicle in almost 3 years (L2PSO) being a trash sidegrade of the 2A5 thats so badly modelled, its add on armor makes it LESS protected than the 2A5!
Britain is far from hated by gaijin compared to Germany, they just suffer from War Thunders modelling of western tech in general. An unfortunate casualty of Gaijins war on reality and blatant propaganda for Russian vehicles and weapons.
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Looks at Tornado F3, then looks at Mig-29
Neither does any of Britains
And britain had the Phantom FGR2/FG1 as their ONLY top tier jet for 3 years and we only got something better in the form of the Harrier Gr7, a ground attacker. Above 9.7 we only had the Jaguar Gr1A to fill the gap until the Phantom FGR2 at 11.3 and that has only just been remedied in the form of a C&P SQV that should have been added a year ago. Whilst Britain has a decent 9.3-9.7 list of aircraft, we have almost nothing competitive above 9.7. You’ve listed a number of aircraft that might have been late, but were added. That cannot be said for Britain.
so are all Tornados
Have you ever looked at the CR2s? They are all C&Ps of each other and quite literally all use the same code from the Leopard for armor. They are the worst top tier tank in game right now bar-none.
At the end of the day. there isnt a least favourite. There is US, USSR and their flavour of the month nation, which I think is Israel or Italy at the moment. Everyone is forgotten about totally. But withwise of Air. Germany has one of the best A2A jets in the game. Britain does not have a Top tier A2A jet. Full stop
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They got their F3 at the same time as the germans got their 29. Performance is irrelevant in this argument as both were late behind other nations.
The british jets have 2x the missile load though and actually used the missiles their equipped with operationally, unlike the F-4F’s 9J’s.
Call up the British MOD and complain to them about their acquisition of aircrafts then.
The difference between Germany is that Germany HAD aircrafts that could have, and WERE added to other nations, but NOT to germany until later dates, britain was more limited. Even then though, the british phantoms were very strong for a long time and the GR.7, though a ground attacker, was the best ground attacker, and a capable air to air fighter when it was added.
Germanys top fighter for a year and a half was the MiG-21 MF, and this was AFTER britain got the FGR.2 in the first place. Germany didnt even get a jet that was competitive to the FGR.2 until 2 years later when the EVENT MiG-23MF was added xD
Britain at least GOT Challenger 2’s lmao, Germany didn’t even get any new Leo 2’s for almost 3 years, and when they did, the new one was mediocre at best as well.
An 11.3 that was barely finished vs a 12.0 Mig-29 that was meta. Tornado F3 was only truly added in La Royale when it got a radar worth mentioning. It was a totally DOA jet for the first 3 months and still the worst “top tier jet” in game. If it can even be described as such being a Full BR behind Top tier currently
To take this back to the necro post you commented on. It is 100% the MO of Gaijin to add aircraft to Britain late or out of order. We could have gotten F3 alongside Mig-29 and F-16, but we got the Gr1. I fully expect Tornado GR4 at or around the same time other nations field the Typhoon. No way Britain gets Typhoon first or with the other 2. As it stands, Im not even sure we’ll get a single addition this year. can almost guarantee F4 ICE this year for Germany
Its not a top tier jet tho lmao. This argument expecting an 11.3 to match a 12.0 is silly. If it did, they’d both be 12.0.
As I already said, the Brits are an unfortunate casualty of Gaijins war against reality and blatant russian propaganda, as well as the fact that in some cases, they just had more substantial jumps in performance compared to some other nations smaller but more frequent performance bumps. The next option for Britain are AMRAAM’s on Tornados, or Eurofighter.
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imagine fighting something thats twice as fast as you with almost the same weapons, like 400 countermeasures, automatic dispensing of said countermeasures, a HMD, a MWS that could potentially detect aircraft, turns better than you, accelerates better than you even without using afterburner and has a radar thats borderline unnotchable with more range than an f-14 radar.
the airframe has a huge effect on the aircraft’s performance.
Sounds good. Typhoon then :) The missing in action F-4F ICE can be added in a year or so as event plane. Just to fit the sceme of the strange F-4 Phantom policy for Germany. Its just too late now to add another F-4 into the current game meta. Would be eaten alive by current and future meta jets. Too late, far too late.