Haaaa my bad then . I dont really know much about the littorio but the armor and the penetration
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Not a problem. I was just trying to answer your question. I’m hoping we get the Littorio class and the Richelieu as well.
yeah those ship are powerfull and cool looking ( + we really need them for a proper top tier for both italy and especialy france )
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also i just tried an EC battle and the dunkerque was more playable than in normal RB battle .
i tried to play it just like IRL at 16 km and with some negative angle and it seems to work against 203mm gun / 305 mm gun and 340 mm (maybe a german 380 too) i survived a lot of shots and better yet my shot where doing some damage against french BB and a bit to germans one ( i did not meet any horst sadly ) .also at 16 km the shot where pretty accurate and where doing some serious fire because of the angle BUT i wasnt able to ammorack anything even with some shots damaging the magazine or blowing up the shell room .
so my conclusion is that the ship have descent armor for long range but the gun still lack a bit in therm of pen , we dont need a lot more but like 60 or 70 mm + of pen would do the job i feel like .
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Does the counter-flooding works for you?
I died few times from the ship tilting to one side while taking in water slowly , and that "leave the ship’ timer appears. It wasn’t even extreme till.
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yeah it happened to me multiple times … also sometimes one single hole made by a single shell whatever the catridge is sink me in a few sec and there is nothing i can do to stop it …
so first : sometimes there are bugged holes that sink the entire ship
and two : the compartment thing dont fully work even when i get regular unraipable holes near the engine i loose like 50-60 % of my buoyancy.
i really think there is a bug but i cant put my hand on a proper record to show it
Can if you were playing it in non ec games how is the 6.7 match maker as in how often do you get a down tiers
Never 💀
The predominant factor in naval gun accuracy was often the turret design rather than the gun itself. The French 4-gun turret was inherently not ideal of small dispersion due to relatively narrow barrel spacing, on top of that French navy for some reason was not aware of the delay coil mechanism until the end of WW2, although their battleships mostly fire in half salvo by discipline which can reduced the dispersion in some degree. However during the action in ww2 French navy noticed Richelieu’s inferior dispersion compared to QE’s 15", even when firing in half salvo. In post war investigations, the 380mm guns even got 1700+m of dispersion when firing in full salvo. After finally applying the delay coil mechanism, dispersion was drastically reduced to 400+m, although it was still noticeably inferior to German and British 15".
So, in a way gaijin actually spared Dunkerque with decent accuracy so she can effectively deal with lightly protected ship.
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that is half true there … you forget to mention that the 1500 m dispersion was with the training shells -- and they where very innacurate . the 300 m dispersion was also noted when they where fired per salvo with regulat shells . (for the richelieu )
also the dunkerque got the delay system mid WW2 in 1940-42
we can notice the first 2 lines fired with OPFK either in full salvo ( 450 m of dispersion ) or individualy ( 270 m ) and that betwen 16 and 25 km .
we can also CLEARLY see "obus B.O.F (that are the training shells ) and in that case YES the dispersion is massive and get up to 1775m at 25 km
with the delay thing (last line ) we can see the dispersion is also 300 but in full salvo so we “just” gain 150 m at 25.7km
so yes indeed it is less precise that the british turret as indicated but NO it is NOT innacurate like a lot pretend without any info. --
The french where plenty aware that the gun where not accurate if fire at the same time ( that why they where firing gun 1 and 3 or 2 and 4 )
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Good to know I won’t be getting repulse for a while then especially as I have hood and nothing can go between them so when they add later ships I won’t have to unlock her
also i dont like to say that but i really think that gaijin make the game "unbalanced " by making some WW2 ship with big gun against early war or way lighter BB in the exemple of france .
the dunkerque is a nice adition dont get me wrong but it’s not a proper BB made for facing BB with bigger gun than 300 mm . and when i see the american line up idk what to say they are almost all WW2 BB with descent armor and pretty good guns even the alaska have enought sauce to do the work done and can survive a some bad shot , the only solution in the case of france would be the Richelieu and ASAP because dunkerque is still not a proper "top tier " in every way ( but the speed ) like ; the gun lack of pen / the armor wasnt made for very big gun at those kind of ranges / and the reload aint that great … (some of those issues are historical while some others are just gaijin choices)
plus you can only play her being in a negative angle otherwise all your ammo are gone or you blow up .
so i really think it’s not very fair to make those kind of BB face some other bigger BB like mutsu or tennessee or even HMS hood since she wasnt made for that in the first place and in a second place some of those ship are considerate as the "best " that some nation have ( like the Hood for exemple was considerate the best ship they had (probably propaganda but still) or even the tennessee because after that it’s the IOWA if im not wrong )
what surprise me the most is that gaijin didnt even try to balance it by letting the dunkerque have some APCBC shell that would add just enought pen to scratch properly those BB (and btw it would still be half historicly accurate just as much as the SAP round ) while some other nation have litteraly a paper shell that have no real proof of whatever stats was written on and yet they thrust it and use it .
i know that im complaining alot but i have 2 excuse for that :
1 it’s not very fair and i dont like what’s not fair and yet can be fixed easly
2 im french and im proud of what my country did and i dont want to see this nation totaly being ignored by people thinking it was bad even IRL (and god know it wasnt the case (not everywhere ofc)).
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It would be an understatement to say that I am quite disappointed with how everything up to this point worked out with Dunkerque.
So far, I believe it would be fair to say that we presented a stronger case for AP than the case given for SAP. The historical context of the shell was clarified (an omni-purpose shell that was designed to replace the role of SAP and AP on many French capital ships), disputable sources were identified and removed from consideration (for instance, 700 mm+ pen values from Garzke and Dulin’s book incorrectly claiming to be based on USN Empirical formula), and a worst case analysis of the shell backed up by a reproducible method of approximation were all provided.
Furthermore, we also brought up the possibility of subdividing the shell rooms and magazines in the damage model like many other ships in the game (Lorraine for example has 4 shell rooms for her 2 rear turrets) which would result in a much lower probability of half your firepower permanently disabled early game from a single shell room detonation.
All these points were brought up NOT because we are trying to make Dunkerque a super meta capital ship killer in-game, nor are we interested in making her more than what she was designed to do historically. We are AWARE that her protection and firepower is not going to be the best in game, REGARDLESS if the previously mentioned improvements were implemented or not.
However, it is frustrating to see that even such minor improvements to shell penetration and module subdivision are either dismissed or ignored, even when there is historical context, mathematical proof, or even existing in-game examples supporting the change. It almost feels like Gaijin wants Dunkerque to be as bad as she already is and refuses to consider any improvements whatsoever.
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Once a while
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While I’m a big fan of Tennessee and think it will probably be better in game than any of the Colorados, even missing ~33-45% of her rate of fire by the standard every other battleship in game uses as she is currently. However she is also pretty far from being second to an Iowa, the North Carolinas should be better by a healthy margin while I’d say there’s really no comparison against a South Dakota. Hood was the strongest British ship when built and certainly their best balance of speed and capability during the interwar, but late refit Warspite and Valiant will be more capable in game, as will Nelson, KGV, and Vanguard. That’s of course without considering ordered but incomplete ships. While it’s unfortunate what they’ve done with the shells Dunkerque is placed as low as is reasonable in br.
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Richelieu would be too OP I feel like.
Rather they should improve Dunkerque like changing SAP to AP, divide shell rooms so you won’t lose half of your firepower with first hit.
And also fix whatever is going on with the “till” that forces you to leave the ship.
If they could fix all that and give us Strasbourg later with 283mm belt and 360mm turrets. That would make France somewhat competitive.
After Tennessee the next step is Colorado class, and after that first fast battleships: North Carolina class > South Dakota class > and only then Iowa class
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I really don’t understand what’s holding them from adding all these improvements. After all this is the best France can get for now (with Strasbourg). Why not to make Dunkerque a bit more competitive?
It still would be one of the worst top tier ship.
Well at least they gave Dunkerque low dispersion.
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My great concern for Strasbourg is that it would seem to me to make the most attractive possible premium battleship for a hypothetical second round of more capable premiums launched alongside the treaty era big hitters. I doubt Courbet is going to be the last premium, and France has very little else unless they add more project ship premiums in the vein of Z47.
My guess, and that goes for @Admiral_Bofors post as well, is that there is a sense of logic only known among Gaijin devs who think this ship is either too recent or too strong or too difficult to balance correctly in its actual configuration for some reasons, so they put artificial buffs/nerf so that it fits right into their ideal position within the game, and no amount of sources and explanations will prevent that. I’ve seen this for years, from tanks to planes (who remembers the 2017 thread with the MB.157 four 7.5mm?). Sometimes, once they’ve decided some vehicles should be a certain way, there’s no changing their decisions. Other times, well, they are open to modifications.
What I would wish is for every vehicles performances to be treated with the same care…
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Normandie will a better candidat for a premium :)