Dassault Rafale - Variants, Characteristics, Armament and Performance

[SidewaysCube946]

I say we ask for Magic II Mk.2, slap that with the real Magic II capabilities on the Rafale, M2K-5F and M4K while keeping the current nerfed Magic on the F1, Jaguar IS and M2K-S5

[Cpt_Bel_V]

Show me picture of your bull@,…
Because you were saying :

@MademoiselleSXXI

But also there are 14 pylons displayed on the Weapons Management Station in the Rafale’s cockpit, where 14 green dots appear marking potential placement

@MademoiselleSXXI

look at the weapon management station and all of its glory with 14 hardpoints

@MademoiselleSXXI

Rafale F3.3: Emports meaning Hardpoints, describes additional hardpoints, backing up the claim

Its quite clear that the choice of 6 missiles on a Rafale is not a limitation past F3.3, but rather, a doctrinal one to maintain stock and lower cost. This goes directly in-line with the limited purchase of Meteors later on

@MademoiselleSXXI

That’s not the only link, not even my own. One was Armee de 'air’s own presentation showing F3.3 with more weapons, 2 side by side Rafales from 2011 with additional weapons, and now you imply the Rafale’s own weapon management station is lying about what the Rafale can do? For what? And where’s the actual proof that it was never wired? The evidence sounds in favor of it being wired; Rafale’s Weapon Management Station, the additional load of the F3.3, the commonly seen pylons under the wings before the flight of the F3R and contract of the F4 Standard…

@MademoiselleSXXI

To say they can’t be used is basically saying that the Rafale’s own weapon management station, the screen showing pylons, has 2 mystery slots that contribute nothing but still show up anyways for no reason

So now i need you to post those 14 dots.

[MademoiselleSXXI]

Hello, the pylons here, showing where they are under the wingtip pylons

[Mathll]

@x-GeeNo_MS-x

you know a gimped MICA-IR with Magic-2 IRCCM its much likely going to be flared easily past 2.5-3km for example.

And why not just a Magic 2 with its realistic performance?

Regarding the 24km it is particularly debatable, some sources rather announce a capacity to fire it to its maximum range

[x-GeeNo_MS-x]

thats another option the Magic-2 MK.II have a better rocket engine if am not wrong, that means more effective range.

[ExcaliburSniper]

MICA-IR should not have been denied.

• The devs had no problem gimping the IRCCM of Magic 2 until other nations caught up.
• They had no problem giving Russia the R27ET with similar range.
• They have no problem gimping the MANPADS lock range against helis to protect Ka50 players.

So MICA IR with the IRCCM of an R73 and lock range of an ET would be completely fine. Could also limit it to two max until other nations catch up.

[SidewaysCube946]

I believe it is the same motor but has a better navigation law and an improved seeker, it should just be a mid life upgrade to the Magic II that updates the technology

[Mathll]

The Magic 2 Mk2 does not exist at all, it is just a name that comes from a translation error concerning the basic Magic 2

Magic 2 which should also have around 15km range and 50g maximum overload

[Cpt_Bel_V]

So that got in line with the fact that F.3.3 and F.4were ready to get recieve the F.4.1 upgraded with 8 missiles.
As i said here:

@Cpt_Bel_V

Every trustful sources point out Rafale F.3R as earlier variants are unable to carry 8 missiles, even if latest aircrafts were made ready to get transformed to F.4 standard as Dassault, Defence ministry and AdAE sources shows that most AdAE F.4.1 would be transformed from F.3.3 and F.3R standards because those have the ability to get transformed.

But that doesn’t mean that F.3.3 // F.3R standards are 8 missiles ready.
Which make choice of Gaijin to keep it at 6 missile completely normal.
Also considering that DGA didn’t qualified the Rafale F.3R and earlier to 8 missiles but 6.

(Note the 14th out front is never used? What do we have here, ECM pod?)

[x-GeeNo_MS-x]

because that would mean that jets like the Jaguar IS, Mirage 2000D, Mirage F1s would be overpowered in the BR they are bro, thats why the most sane option is just adding a gimped MICA to only top BR jets.

[SidewaysCube946]

No, I do not want to fly with weapons that aren’t accurate representations of what it is capable of. Having fake MICAs is not a good alternative to a lack of IR missiles.

[x-GeeNo_MS-x]

better than not have IR missiles, also with the time passing by they can just unlock his full potential you dont think? also the AAM-3 is not an accurate representations of what it is IRL, the Magic-2 too, the R-27ET too… soo… its not the first time bro

[MademoiselleSXXI]

It also means the Rafale had hardpoints underneath the wings with multiple examples of Rafale F3Rs, F3.3s, of various types from the B, to C, to the M carrying the MICA on that hardpoint

Both sides of the argument are equally viable, do you go for capabilities, or actual employment? If they refuse to un-gimp MICA-EM, I think the latter

[Cpt_Bel_V]

Cpabilities:

@Cpt_Bel_V

Also considering that DGA didn’t qualified the Rafale F.3R and earlier to 8 missiles but 6.

Are capabilities, since SP3 weren’t provided at those time.

[Mathll]

You have just pointed out exactly the problem with what you are proposing, what do you do with the lower Br planes that can carry this kind of missile, what happens to the Tornado, the 2000D RMV, the A-10C? Well they will either be too powerful or they will go up to Br which will make them unplayable in the end

[MademoiselleSXXI]

I’ll take physical and existing Rafale F3s to be a pretty good demonstration of their capabilities, showing that the option existed and was there the entire time

[SidewaysCube946]

The solution is giving it Magic IIs, or just straight up not having IR missiles, the F-16C is typically run with 6 AIM-120s and it does just fine.

Also if you think they will bring it up from a gimped state that is tragic, it will be left to rot there and absolutely suck later.

[x-GeeNo_MS-x]

a Mirage-2000D-RMV with just 2 MICA-IRs i dont see it being a problem in 12.7 mate honestly speaking, the A-10C its fine in 11.7 even 12.0 i dont see many A-10Cs actually because they are soo slow that they can get easily jumped.

[Mathll]

So according to you an A-10C with 4 AIM-9X will not go up to BR ?

And I’m sorry but a 2000D RMV with 2 Mica IR will necessarily go up to Br

[Cpt_Bel_V]

The option existed, for future implementation,… not for direct use.

As told earlier, prototype were made on DGA Rafales

If AdAE wanted those Pylons, Aircrafts would have been required to go to transformation.

A software being ready doesn’t prove that wiring was ready underneath the wing.

Therefore, it is not alike “field modification” we’ve seen for tanks, or for Bf-109F gunpods for exemples.

Gaijin is right on the 6 missiles, anyway goes the MICA fixing,… but if no MICA fix, there is no reason to pay snail anymore.