No, I know that the PL-8 is modeled as a PL-8B. The PL-5B has a seeker which for some reason magically changes in opaqueness depending on lighting.
Not yet and they think they can’t for some reason, every time it is brought up it’s the same “muh dokuments” Even wen that is not possible in this scenario.
PL12 has never used 9B1348，PL12 has always used 9B1103M
What documents, u can see it. The thing has been passed, but they just can’t be bothered in this case.
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Isn’t that the supposed to be R27EA/EM seeker, also R37z seeker rather than R-77’s one which PL12 used?
PL12 uses the guide head of R77-1 instead of R77
happens to some extent with the magic 2 and pl-8b, pl-5b’s model is nearly entirely incorrect on the other hand
Thats a thing that all small IR missiles have in game.
As I understand, China didn’t buy any R-77-1 until Su35s came, and that the 9B1103 were only purchased from Ukraine. R-77-1 only entered service in 2015, so by logic it wouldn’t be using R-77-1 seeker as post 2010(ish) PL-12 was fully domestic. I saw stuff that suggested at least initially R-77 seeker was used.
9B1103MThe guide head is jointly developed by the Agate Research Institute of China and Russia, with partial funding provided by China and technology provided by Russia. Therefore, the service life of R77-1 will not affect the use of 9B1103M guide head in PL12
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Doubt that its fake since we had access to does document a while ago and other sources stating that the PL8B was fully domestically build
They changed seeker and gave it a better motor with more thrust alongside a longer burn time on the sustainer
Ive heard somewhere that they manage to reduce its drag by changing the material of the main body but idk a lot about that
Rn the motor on the pl8b is the same impulse as the python 3 but with a longer burn time
Everything I’ve seen on that motor seems to have came from papers talking about a proposed motor for the pl8, not that it actually has it
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It’s a proposal written by a student. A very well written one but a proposal nonetheless.
But the 9B1103M wasn’t developed in 2003, Agat only had 9B1348 as a finished product cause 9B1103’s initial designated missile was R37 and by 1999 the development for R37 was halted, and not restarted until 2006, so R77’s 9B1348 would have been the only available seeker Russia was able to provide with confidence. Also I think China never acquired 9B1103 from Russia but a much earlier version from Ukraine.
China obtained information on the 9B1103M in 1998. Additionally, the PL-12 did not use the original 9B-1103M radar seeker, only incorporating partial technologies from it.
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I know, but 9B1103 was derived from 9B1348 and I would say the PL12 seeker probably was really a 9B1348 seeker from R-77, cause obviously China switched to full domestic seekers later, but the exact time they got these seekers I am not sure.
Rumour goes China got earlier versions of 9B1103 tech from Ukraine, which were designed for R37 and Buk, but IDK to what extent are they the same as the Russian versions cause they are in theory developed separately.
That isn’t entirely true though, China acquired R-27 production license around the same time.
The claim that the PL-12 uses the 9B-1103M seeker is a misconception. China’s missile institutes did not import the physical 9B1103M units during the PL-12’s development. Agat provided technical collaboration and consulting, not direct hardware transfer.
Spoiler
Ukrainian involvement is even less likely, as Sino-Ukrainian defense cooperation began much later. The 9B-1348 is also incorrect – as Liang stated, the PL-12’s seeker incorporated new technologies that were still immature during the R-77’s development phase.
Spoiler
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To my knowledge, China has never domestically produced R-27s.
I think they have, or at least upgraded them, they bought production license from Ukraine I am pretty sure, from artem. Cause R27s are pretty bad at BVR, and even WVR it is pretty much useless, especially when compared to AMRAAM and MICA. PLA then looked to Ukraine for upgrades of seeker.
China did apparently buy them in large amounts as well, but some say rather than purchase they are really ‘upgrades’.
Here it says R27R but since no other missile upgrades on this websites seem to be shown they could be ERs as well.
No documents or records related to R-27 production licensing have been found within China, strongly suggesting this is a misunderstanding. The only verified information pertains to China seeking guidance system upgrades for R-27s from Artem, driven by Russia’s high pricing versus Ukraine’s cost-effective alternatives.
Both are true. In the mid-1990s, after Artem representatives engaged with Chinese in Beijing, the company upgraded existing R-27 missiles previously acquired by China from Russia and directly sold several new batches of R-27s to China.