Does it have 5 crew or what lol u just killed 3 of em and it didn’t die. Which btw happened to me the other day.
1 Like
5 Crew, T90M hull, spall liners, no basket, smaller ammo than a T series and an unmanned turret and some guys still wonder why people complain about the BMPTs survivability lol
1 Like
fk sake man, I never realised it was 5 crew btw I thought it was 4 after I had shot it didn’t kill it.
They are absolutely ridiculous TBF it’s not even up for debate lol
Even the absolute worst players have a 2,0 KD with it but 0.5 with everything else.
lets also not gloss over how much damage the 30mm it has seems to be oding yet the same cannon on a BMP2M with darts does nothing
3 Likes
Yeah, it means a lower plate shot needs to basically be dead centre, straight on for a 1 shot - at an angle, it just kills the 3 in the hull
It doesn’t help that there are consistent examples of darts entering the turret fighting compartment and doing no damage, you can see one in that clip (and several others I’ve posted)
1 Like
hell that happens literally between two terminators in teh same game most the time.
I one tapped one last match through the side into the ammo, shot a dude in teh exacy same spot “critical hit” nothing done to it.
1 Like
The funniest part about this whole saga is that someone at Gaijin took a look at all the things i mentioned and went: “hm yes, 10.3 sounds absolutely adequate.”
High rpm autocannons are way too good at what they do in general, mid tier is being terrorized by Gepards and XM246s and top tier gets the same treatment but plopped on an MBT hull on steroids.
3 Likes
they seem to Fk up every IFV BR but this was just ridiculous from the get go.
Agreed 100 percent man, got Gepards shredding Fully armoured MBTs which are a full BR or so higher and one tapping them. Hell I’ve had it happen in my Ariete lol at 117…
But my point was, the specific cannon on the BMPT / BMPT72 does substantially more damage than the already in game exact same auto cannon found on the BMP2 or BMP2M.
I’ve had the bmp2M spray my Ariete, chinese MBTs etc frontally and do nothing and I can return fire, then the BMPT will cut clean through ti as if it’s got about 200 pen.
just as a caveat I am also not gonna gloss over the fact the pantsir is still 12.0 for no reason.
1 Like
Ah i see. If i had to give a non-educated guess then id say its probably the spaghetti code being overwhelmed with 2 550 rpm autocannons at the same time and damage calculation going out the window because of it.
But it might just be just coded better for no reason. After what ive seen on the Pantsir SM SV thread yesterday nothing would surprise me tbh
2 Likes
Yeah I’m so sick and tired of having my barrel destroyed by autocannons, it’s partly what makes these terminators so dangerous because if one’s hiding his weak spots, you can’t even push over a hill to get at them before all your external components are destroyed
5 Likes
we literally have LMURs in the game. They have a hardcoded high loft. Unlike LMURs, Spikes are HEAT and not SAPHE meaning that even if they do pen the chances to kill someone are lower compared to overpressure.
Additionally, smoke grenades exists and i cannot stress this enough; MOST SPIKE TANKS HAVE ONLY 4 SPIKES and are easy to kill from any range and any angle!!!
its funny you mention puma because youre arguing about how OP spikes would be with a buff/fix to their actual performance yet you yourself have barely played a spike vehicle.
I find it very funny that most of the people that tend to argue against spikes tend to be those that have very limited or no experience in spike vehicles at all, and even with that limited experience they cant even get a 1:1 KD/KS despite arguing how powerful spikes are.
So saying “i hear you” and then saying “but it would be so OP” when i point out multiple reasons why vehicles at 10.7-11.0 that are effectively 9.7 autocannon light tanks with 4 spikes duck taped are often literally worse than just having a tow launcher attached is pretty ludicrous.
And please explain to me how it would be any worse than something like BMP2Ms Kornets that you can fire on the move, effectively ignore smokes and have enough pen where “no amount of armor can realistically save you”.
Or how these vehicles have to contend with BMPTs that dont care about spikes unless the person firing them has hit a jackpot and the seeker decides to guide itself towards 1 out of like 12 other spots it can connect to that can result in a killing shot. On top of the fact that BMPTs also have access to 4/8 fire on the move stabilized Atakas with plentiful range, beamriding guidance, high speed and high pen and a turret with high RoF APDS capable of disabling all threats.
oh and by that same logic btw TOW2Bs and BILLs are the most OP missiles ingame because hey, you can fire them from behind cover too using commander optics and they do hit the spot where “no amount of armor can realistically save you”. AND compared to spikes not even popping smoke can stop the missile from hitting.
Surely vehicles with TOW2Bs and BILLs are destroying the game and are sitting at 12.0+ BR to compensate… what do you mean they are at 8.7, 9.7 and 10.3 BR and the missiles are abysmal…
One problem with SPIKEs is how unreliable the lock can sometimes be, not sure if it’s bad programming by Gaijin or just a common bug, but sometimes you can have a clear line of sight and still not be able to get a lock, so even shooting from behind cover isn’t that likely to happen in a lot of cases
2 Likes
it didnt used to be as bad as it is now, often times now you cant get a lock somehow despite the target being in an open field for no particular reason.
And like 2-4 updates back an annoying bug got added with spikes (and other IR missiles, mavericks, Kh38s, spices/GBU15s/HOSBOs, etc.) where even if you get a lock youre prevented from firing the missile for some reason.
So many times i would have gotten multiple kills in a row if my spikes were TOWs instead where i could fire them instead of having to wait for the server to be like “i guess ill allow him to shoot at the person in open field now”
They are unreliable to get a lock, unreliable to keep the lock during flight (another banger that started happening like 2 updates ago, where spikes started to fall short or fail to guide in because the target drove near a tree), unreliable to guide in towards the correct spot that can be a killing blow and unreliable even if they do pen through as they often on pen do limited amount of damage.
I think i started noticing the issue around the time where they removed being able to lock onto drones with it
Felt significantly worse even against ground targets and helis after that, so maybe they just nerfed the “sensitivity” or something
1 Like
i have played Spike vehicles, and they suck. I had to stop playing the PUMA because of how miserable it is. But arguing that a missile’s real life performance would be strong to overpowered does not constitute me saying Spikes are overpowered. Quite the contemporary.
And your argument for Tow-2B’s is kind of ridiculous. Spikes are fine and forget, Tow 2B’s are not. You bring up the BMP-2, but it fire 2 missiles at targets and then zip back into cover? Not really.
If LMUR’s already have lofting though (which I unaware of), I see no reason why they don’t buff Spikes. If they are too strong, revert them back to a slightly more gimped version. If they aren’t, keep them buffed.
1 Like
You guys and the LMURS they’re good but they also leave a lot of tanks alive and can be shot out the sky easily with SPAA.
1 Like
firstly:
vs
second:
vs
On one hand youre here being like “oh nooo, if we buff them a bit too much they will completely destroy the balance” and then youre saying “i had to stop playing the vehicle with spikes because of how miserable it was”
Literally cannot make up your mind. So is the vehicle too weak where playing it is miserable and needs a buff/fix to its weaponry that it actually works correctly as it should or is the prospect of actually functional missiles that IT HAS ONLY 4 OF such a terror-inducing that it should remain as it is, meaning miserable.
Because “we should buff it just a little bit” is so moronic in the context of a lightly armored vehicle with only 4 designated anti-tank weapons in a tank deathmatch arena game facing up to 16 enemy players.
No it isnt. TOW2Bs entire gimmick is that they hit where the armor is the weakest. Unfortunately TOW2Bs are absolutely abysmal if youve ever tried them. The damage is inconsistent both where it happens and the severity, very much similar to Spikes.
And very similarly to spikes, TOW2Bs from something like Wiesel1A2 or M3A3 can be fired from the safety of cover, as the commander sight is above the turret in case of Bradley and the TOW turret in case of Wiesel is above the hull.
The BMP2M is capable of firing all 4 of its ATGMs in a row on the move with sufficient speed and penetration to not have a problem. This was in context of your point of “hitting where the armor is the weakest” pointing towards ATGMs that are in general unaffected by vast majority of armor profile of tanks due to extremely high penetration value
Please pay attention to what the point was for bringing up BMP2M!
Somehow im not surprised you werent aware of that.
Just for comparison sake;
Spoiler
Mi28NM has access up to 8 LMURs with 10+km range, high loft, extremely good probability of kill due to the impact angle and 20kg SAPHE warhead which kills via overpressure and not HEAT jet and gets rearmed in safety of its helipad.
It is also nearly immune to tanks and spikes funnily enough.
Spike ground vehicles range between 4 missiles (Puma VJTF, Vilkas, Boxer GER + GB and both Namers+Eitan), 6 (CV90Mk4) and 10 (Freccia and Freccia OWS) with only 2 missiles to fire per load.
All of the above vehicles are capable of dying extremely easy or being disabled extremely easy.
Unlike LMURs the Spikes use HEAT jets to deal damage, the impact angle is shallow and so their entire guidance and probability of kill is unreliable and low. On top of having accuracy issues due to not being fired from the air like in the case of LMURs but rather ground, logically.
The only way to get more spikes is by sitting on a point (dangerous) which requires your team to even hold a point in the first place.
The point here is that we literally have missiles that do effectively the same thing as Spikes should do already in game and they do it better, so theres genuinely 0 reason for Spikes to remain as weak as they are. If they end up finally making the vehicles stronger then guess what, thats what the battle rating system is for.
wow, we finally got somewhere.
Or maybe we could use the MECHANIC inside THE GAME called THE BATTLE RATING SYSTEM to balance vehicles instead of keeping them GIMPED to somehow keep them low BR instead of actually making them function as they should!
1 Like
Do Spikes have IOG because I cannot tell you how many times it has stayed locked on me through smoke (and yes I do move after popping smoke when I see them fired at me).
1 Like
No, they lack it. They are pure IR.
Depending on when youve popped the smoke the missile might have enough inertia to fly through smoke and hit you but generally when you pop smoke they will fall short.
Moving might keep a small part of your tank outside of the smoke AoE letting it to guide in, but the missiles dont have IOG
Got it guess I just got unlucky. They almost always hit my turret roof too so it’s instant death.